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Due to incessant bickering typical of the Rules Forum, we've (Admin/Moderators) come close to deleting the Rules Forum altogether. (Several times.) We've decided to keep it (by a narrow margin), however, with this stipulation:

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Shotgun max rounds

#1 User is offline   outerlimits 

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Posted 15 October 2009 - 01:00 PM

so after ft benning, we all know what happens when you load more than the max in tactical. curious what happens if one were to load more than max in open. match dq? :wacko:
"We're Marines, We took Iwo Jima. Baghdad ain't shit." - Gen. Kelly, USMC

"We have two companies of Marines running rampant all over the northern half of this island, and three Army regiments pinned down in the southwestern corner, doing nothing. What the hell is going on? " - Gen. John W. Vessey Jr., USA, Chairman of the the Joint Chiefs of Staff; during the assault on Grenada, 1983

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#2 User is offline   BayouSlide 

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Posted 15 October 2009 - 01:10 PM

Unless I'm overlooking something, the only recourse that comes to mind under the rule book would be match DQ for Unsportsmanlike Conduct, in this case, cheating.

10.6.1 Competitors will be disqualified from a match for conduct which a
Range Officer deems to be unsportsmanlike. Examples of unsportsmanlike
conduct include, but are not limited to, cheating, dishonesty,
failing to comply with the reasonable directions of a Match Official, or
any behavior likely to bring the sport into disrepute. The Range Master
must be notified as soon as possible.

Anything else?

Curtis

This post has been edited by BayouSlide: 15 October 2009 - 01:11 PM

"Believe nothing just because a so-called wise person said it. Believe nothing just because a belief is generally held. Believe nothing just because it is said in ancient books. Believe nothing just because it is said to be of divine origin. Believe nothing just because someone else believes it. Believe only what you yourself test and judge to be true." -- Buddha

#3 User is offline   11.43mm 

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Posted 15 October 2009 - 01:11 PM

View Postouterlimits, on Oct 15 2009, 01:00 PM, said:

so after ft benning, we all know what happens when you load more than the max in tactical. curious what happens if one were to load more than max in open. match dq? :wacko:

I thought you had to shoot that round.?

#4 User is offline   BayouSlide 

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Posted 15 October 2009 - 01:14 PM

View Post11.43mm, on Oct 15 2009, 03:11 PM, said:

View Postouterlimits, on Oct 15 2009, 01:00 PM, said:

so after ft benning, we all know what happens when you load more than the max in tactical. curious what happens if one were to load more than max in open. match dq? :wacko:

I thought you had to shoot that round.?


Under USPSA rules, Open's a maximum of 11 rounds loaded, or a maximum of 10 in the case of Rule 8.1.1.2.

Curtis
"Believe nothing just because a so-called wise person said it. Believe nothing just because a belief is generally held. Believe nothing just because it is said in ancient books. Believe nothing just because it is said to be of divine origin. Believe nothing just because someone else believes it. Believe only what you yourself test and judge to be true." -- Buddha

#5 User is offline   Nik Habicht 

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Posted 15 October 2009 - 01:17 PM

View PostBayouSlide, on Oct 15 2009, 04:10 PM, said:

Unless I'm overlooking something, the only recourse that comes to mind under the rule book would be match DQ for Unsportsmanlike Conduct, in this case, cheating.

10.6.1 Competitors will be disqualified from a match for conduct which a
Range Officer deems to be unsportsmanlike. Examples of unsportsmanlike
conduct include, but are not limited to, cheating, dishonesty,
failing to comply with the reasonable directions of a Match Official, or
any behavior likely to bring the sport into disrepute. The Range Master
must be notified as soon as possible.

Anything else?

Curtis

It's not a match dq --- but since the competitor is no longer compliant with any division, he's shooting for no score. Pretty much the same thing as going sub-minor in Production (or any other division, but production shooters are most at risk....)
Nik

You're shooting Steel like an A class shooter. Why are you shooting the Paper so slowly? ---- Dave Marques, Production Nationals, 2005

This is a game of high-speed precision. If you don't precisely plan what you want to happen, there's not much chance that it will. ---- Brian Enos, 2004

#6 User is offline   BayouSlide 

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Posted 15 October 2009 - 01:23 PM

View PostNik Habicht, on Oct 15 2009, 03:17 PM, said:

It's not a match dq --- but since the competitor is no longer compliant with any division, he's shooting for no score. Pretty much the same thing as going sub-minor in Production (or any other division, but production shooters are most at risk....)


I thought I was missing something: thanks, Nik. Logical enough...especially if you put your brain fully in gear before typing. :cheers:

I love the rules forum: always end up learning something.

Curtis

This post has been edited by BayouSlide: 15 October 2009 - 01:27 PM

"Believe nothing just because a so-called wise person said it. Believe nothing just because a belief is generally held. Believe nothing just because it is said in ancient books. Believe nothing just because it is said to be of divine origin. Believe nothing just because someone else believes it. Believe only what you yourself test and judge to be true." -- Buddha

#7 User is offline   outerlimits 

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Posted 15 October 2009 - 01:25 PM

yep-6.2.5.1
"We're Marines, We took Iwo Jima. Baghdad ain't shit." - Gen. Kelly, USMC

"We have two companies of Marines running rampant all over the northern half of this island, and three Army regiments pinned down in the southwestern corner, doing nothing. What the hell is going on? " - Gen. John W. Vessey Jr., USA, Chairman of the the Joint Chiefs of Staff; during the assault on Grenada, 1983

"A golf course is the willful and deliberate misuse of a perfectly good rifle range." - Jeff Cooper

"Character is doing what's right when nobody's looking." - J.C. Watts

#8 User is offline   11.43mm 

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Posted 15 October 2009 - 01:31 PM

HA! That would make a geat Tee shirt NOT COMPLIANT IN ANY DIVISION!!! And I might be able to stop wearing my "STAY BACK 100 FEET" Tee

#9 User is online   kend 

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Posted 20 October 2009 - 08:06 PM

I saw Jerry using a mag tube that looked about 4 feet long, it stuck out waaay past the muzzle. I don't know which match it was but it was on TV on Shooting USA or something, what Division would that fit in?
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#10 User is offline   outerlimits 

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Posted 20 October 2009 - 08:54 PM

View Postkend, on Oct 20 2009, 08:06 PM, said:

I saw Jerry using a mag tube that looked about 4 feet long, it stuck out waaay past the muzzle. I don't know which match it was but it was on TV on Shooting USA or something, what Division would that fit in?

every match except a uspsa match-in uspsa, we run limited 10 in open! go figure!
"We're Marines, We took Iwo Jima. Baghdad ain't shit." - Gen. Kelly, USMC

"We have two companies of Marines running rampant all over the northern half of this island, and three Army regiments pinned down in the southwestern corner, doing nothing. What the hell is going on? " - Gen. John W. Vessey Jr., USA, Chairman of the the Joint Chiefs of Staff; during the assault on Grenada, 1983

"A golf course is the willful and deliberate misuse of a perfectly good rifle range." - Jeff Cooper

"Character is doing what's right when nobody's looking." - J.C. Watts

#11 User is offline   mscott 

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Posted 21 October 2009 - 02:56 AM

So when the Saiga guys pull out their 25 round drums they shoot for no score if the match is run under USPSA rules?

This post has been edited by mscott: 21 October 2009 - 03:03 AM

#12 User is offline   Wakal 

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Posted 21 October 2009 - 03:10 AM

Haven't seen a 25-round drum... :)

Depends on the match. If IPSC, no problem. If "outlaw," no problem. If USPSA, then they shoot for no score. Can't have more than 10 rounds (plus one in the chamber) in USPSA Open.

Holdover from the Olde Klinton Daze, of course, and MV likes it so there it is. Not bashin', just sayin'...

The Pan-Am Shotgun Match next year (run under IPSC rules, not USPSA) should be fun. Load 'em up, cowboys! :D






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#13 User is offline   Charles Bond 

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Posted 21 October 2009 - 08:07 PM

View Postkend, on Oct 20 2009, 11:06 PM, said:

I saw Jerry using a mag tube that looked about 4 feet long, it stuck out waaay past the muzzle. I don't know which match it was but it was on TV on Shooting USA or something, what Division would that fit in?


He was shooting open at the Ft Benning Three Gun which does not use USPSA rules.

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Posted 22 October 2009 - 03:41 AM

View PostWakal, on Oct 21 2009, 06:10 AM, said:

Haven't seen a 25-round drum... :)
Alex

Maybe it was a 20?? I don't remember for sure, but one thing I noticed is that it didn't run worth a crap.

#15 User is offline   Charles Bond 

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Posted 22 October 2009 - 05:22 AM

View Postmscott, on Oct 22 2009, 06:41 AM, said:

View PostWakal, on Oct 21 2009, 06:10 AM, said:

Haven't seen a 25-round drum... :)
Alex

Maybe it was a 20?? I don't remember for sure, but one thing I noticed is that it didn't run worth a crap.


Al Zeta had a special drum built for his shotgun which was featured in the Ft Benning coverage of Shooting USA and I think it held 23. He had only one and mentioned it was valued at about $3K. Of course if we all had the ability he has and the tooling to go with it, firearms technology would double about every 3 years.

And by the way, anything Zeta brings to the range runs flawlessly.

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 01:17 PM

View Postouterlimits, on Oct 20 2009, 08:54 PM, said:

View Postkend, on Oct 20 2009, 08:06 PM, said:

I saw Jerry using a mag tube that looked about 4 feet long, it stuck out waaay past the muzzle. I don't know which match it was but it was on TV on Shooting USA or something, what Division would that fit in?

every match except a uspsa match-in uspsa, we run limited 10 in open! go figure!




Silly rule, we don't limit pistol or rifle to 10 in open?

#17 User is offline   M ammo 

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 01:23 PM

View PostTonyH, on Oct 30 2009, 01:17 PM, said:

View Postouterlimits, on Oct 20 2009, 08:54 PM, said:

View Postkend, on Oct 20 2009, 08:06 PM, said:

I saw Jerry using a mag tube that looked about 4 feet long, it stuck out waaay past the muzzle. I don't know which match it was but it was on TV on Shooting USA or something, what Division would that fit in?

every match except a uspsa match-in uspsa, we run limited 10 in open! go figure!




Silly rule, we don't limit pistol or rifle to 10 in open?

+1 Open should be OPEN.

Jim M ammo

#18 User is offline   gose 

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 01:37 PM

I can see how there's a place for L10 and the 10 round limit in Production, but the 10 round limit for Open in Shotgun is pretty silly...

Has anyone seriously tried to get USPSA to change it?

This post has been edited by gose: 30 October 2009 - 01:38 PM

USPSA: TY56081
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#19 User is offline   TonyH 

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 02:43 PM

Yep, been ask to many times to even care anymore. Still no good reason why.
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