[Will_M]

I want to make major with WST out of an M&P40 with 170/180 gr black bullets. The problem is the max load is listed at 4.3 gr which won't give me the PF I need. Is it safe to push past the listed max loads with WST?

P.S. I did do a search and all the data listed for WST was for S_I guns that can accept a much longer OAL than I can. I've found a happy place with my M&P right around 1.132"

Is it possible to make major from an M&P (or even glock since I think they're limited to the relatively short OAL as well) with WST with 170/180 gr bullets?

This post has been edited by Will_M: 31 August 2009 - 01:14 PM

[rmerritt]

My wife shoots a M&P 40, using 6gr of winchester auto comp, with a PF of 172, mg 180 jhp,col 1.24, for what its wirth.

[Will_M]

rmerritt, on Aug 31 2009, 02:36 PM, said:

My wife shoots a M&P 40, using 6gr of winchester auto comp, with a PF of 172, mg 180 jhp,col 1.24, for what its wirth.

Do you mean 1.124? 1.24 is pretty long

[pstew]

Here's some WST load data I posted a while back. 176 gr lead out of a 4' S&W M&P

aa7 data powder & WST data

[rmerritt]

Correct 1.124, did i mention my typeing sucks!!! lol

[Will_M]

Any signs of pressure once you get towards 5 grains?

[P.Pres]

I have ran 5.0 WST under a Renier 180 plated but at 1.185 in an STI, no presure signs.
With lead you can use even less, 5.0 was pretty hot anyway but I never did crono that load, I'm thinking
4.6-4.7 will do it but you need to work up and ck for presure signs along the way. Crono would be a great
idea also.

You know I swear they changed the factory data since Hodgden took over completely. I was shooting WST about
winter 08 and I know the old online data went to something like 4.7-4.8 but I'm not positive. They may have changed
the formula or Hodgden's tests showed pressure signs earlier ?? Who knows, work it up and see what you get in your gun ..

This post has been edited by P.Pres: 31 August 2009 - 02:41 PM

[Will_M]

P.Pres, on Aug 31 2009, 04:34 PM, said:

I have ran 5.0 WST under a Renier 180 plated but at 1.185 in an STI, no presure signs.
With lead you can use even less, 5.0 was pretty hot anyway but I never did crono that load, I'm thinking
4.6-4.7 will do it but you need to work up and ck for presure signs along the way. Crono would be a great
idea also.

You know I swear they changed the factory data since Hodgden took over completely. I was shooting WST about
winter 08 and I know the old online data went to something like 4.7-4.8 but I'm not positive. They may have changed
the formula or Hodgden's tests showed pressure signs earlier ?? Who knows, work it up and see what you get in your gun ..

I ALWAYS chrono my loads, but this will be the first time I'll be pushing bounds in a pistol cartridge. What signs to look for in a pistol cartridge?

[P.Pres]

Will_M, on Aug 31 2009, 03:48 PM, said:

P.Pres, on Aug 31 2009, 04:34 PM, said:

I have ran 5.0 WST under a Renier 180 plated but at 1.185 in an STI, no presure signs.
With lead you can use even less, 5.0 was pretty hot anyway but I never did crono that load, I'm thinking
4.6-4.7 will do it but you need to work up and ck for presure signs along the way. Crono would be a great
idea also.

You know I swear they changed the factory data since Hodgden took over completely. I was shooting WST about
winter 08 and I know the old online data went to something like 4.7-4.8 but I'm not positive. They may have changed
the formula or Hodgden's tests showed pressure signs earlier ?? Who knows, work it up and see what you get in your gun ..

I ALWAYS chrono my loads, but this will be the first time I'll be pushing bounds in a pistol cartridge. What signs to look for in a pistol cartridge?

First thing will be the primer flatening out and oozing out to the sides. I need to check my books but I may just have
chrono data for that load at home. I'll PM you later tonight..

[ryan45kim]

My experiences don’t seam to be the norm here but when I tried to make major with WST it did not work. I was using 180gr plated bullets at 1.200 OAL and I started separating case heads at around 175 power factor. I like to load between 175 to 180 PF so I’m safe at the chronograph. The difference between 165PF and 180PF is only 74FPS with an 180gr bullet. I switched to WSF and I can make 180PF while remaining in book specks at standard OAL. I still use WST for minor and steel loads but I will not use it for major loads. I would use a slower powder but I seam to be in the minority.

PS looking at primers is NOT a reliable pressure indicator. I have friends in the ammunition industry that have all the fancy pressure equipment. They had a 9x19 round that ran 50000psi and the primers looked fine, no flowing at all.

This post has been edited by ryan45kim: 31 August 2009 - 11:43 PM

[sperman]

I loaded some 165 gr. MG JHP. It took 5.5 grains of WST to make major. I only loaded enough for the chrono. When I go back to shooting this I will have to check for signs of high pressure.

ETA shot through a M&P .40 S&W.

This post has been edited by sperman: 01 September 2009 - 11:49 AM

[Will_M]

sperman, on Sep 1 2009, 06:47 AM, said:

I loaded some 165 gr. MG JHP. It took 5.5 grains of WST to make major. I only loaded enough for the chrono. When I go back to shooting this I will have to check for signs of high pressure.

I really hope the 4 pounds of WST I bought isn't going to go to waste. I thought a lot of people used WST to make major??

Is it because they're using 5"+ barrels?

[sperman]

Will_M, on Sep 1 2009, 12:07 PM, said:

sperman, on Sep 1 2009, 06:47 AM, said:

I loaded some 165 gr. MG JHP. It took 5.5 grains of WST to make major. I only loaded enough for the chrono. When I go back to shooting this I will have to check for signs of high pressure.

I really hope the 4 pounds of WST I bought isn't going to go to waste. I thought a lot of people used WST to make major??

Is it because they're using 5"+ barrels?

I like WST for .40 major because there is no chance of a double charge.  I can't remember off the top of my head how many grains it takes to make major out of my 6" STI, but I've shot thousands of rounds without incident.

[bulm540]

4.3 - 4.4 makes major in my fat free

[Will_M]

bulm540, on Sep 1 2009, 10:13 PM, said:

4.3 - 4.4 makes major in my fat free

With lead/moly or jacketed?

[P.Pres]

Will_M, on Sep 2 2009, 10:25 AM, said:

bulm540, on Sep 1 2009, 10:13 PM, said:

4.3 - 4.4 makes major in my fat free

With lead/moly or jacketed?

Fat free is a 6" gun !!

This post has been edited by P.Pres: 02 September 2009 - 10:33 AM

[ryan45kim]

I was loading for my Para P16 with a 5” barrel. Like I said I seam to be in the minority. I have read many posts from people who load WST to major in 40S&W, that is why I tried it. I love WST for my lead practice load but it is not a major load. I can only comment on my experiences.

[Will_M]

ryan45kim, on Sep 3 2009, 02:57 AM, said:

I was loading for my Para P16 with a 5” barrel. Like I said I seam to be in the minority. I have read many posts from people who load WST to major in 40S&W, that is why I tried it. I love WST for my lead practice load but it is not a major load. I can only comment on my experiences.

I had to get 5.5 grains of WST before I got up to the 1,000 fps I need to make major with the 170 grain precisions I'm using. And even then, my chrono was spotty, spitting out inconsistent velocities.

See my new thread in the general reloading area.

[bulm540]

Will_M, on Sep 2 2009, 09:25 AM, said:

bulm540, on Sep 1 2009, 10:13 PM, said:

4.3 - 4.4 makes major in my fat free

With lead/moly or jacketed?

Moly but this is with a 6 in barrel. 4.6 gave me 180 PF. OAL At 1.170

[mark9765]

I have been loading 4.0gr WST with a 180gr lead TC bullet from Missouri Bullets @ 1.125. I haven't been able to chrono this load due to my chrono being perminently "borrowed". I shoot an XD40 4" barrel. It shots accurate with a low recoil. Has anyone chronoed a load similar to this?

This post has been edited by mark9765: 09 September 2009 - 08:11 PM

[bulm540]

mark9765, on Sep 9 2009, 09:09 PM, said:

I have been loading 4.0gr WST with a 180gr lead TC bullet from Missouri Bullets @ 1.125. I haven't been able to chrono this load due to my chrono being perminently "borrowed". I shoot an XD40 4" barrel. It shots accurate with a low recoil. Has anyone chronoed a load similar to this?

It will proabably not make major. I load 4.3 to 4.4 @ 1.170 OAL for a 172 PF and this is with a 6 in barrel.

This post has been edited by bulm540: 10 September 2009 - 10:30 AM

[Will_M]

bulm540, on Sep 10 2009, 12:29 PM, said:

mark9765, on Sep 9 2009, 09:09 PM, said:

I have been loading 4.0gr WST with a 180gr lead TC bullet from Missouri Bullets @ 1.125. I haven't been able to chrono this load due to my chrono being perminently "borrowed". I shoot an XD40 4" barrel. It shots accurate with a low recoil. Has anyone chronoed a load similar to this?

It will proabably not make major. I load 4.3 to 4.4 @ 1.170 OAL for a 172 PF and this is with a 6 in barrel.

I feel certain it won't. I had to load up 5.5 grains of WST to just make 168 PF out of a 4.25 inch barrel. OAL was 1.13"

[calishootr]

I load 4.3??? grs of WST on a bearcreek moly 200 gr and 4.5 or so for the 180's and have no problem making major, loading them out to 1.195-1.200 for MG 180's i was loading 5.2, been a while id have to look at some records, but i have no probs making major w/ WST, and when i bought it it was only 10 bucks a lb....

[bulm540]

He is using a M&P 40 with a 4.25 in barrel.

[Harmon]

i loaded it in my glock 22 with factory barrel and ranier 180 jhp at 1.150 (too long for high caps but this was during the AWB) under 5.0 grains and federal 200 primer for 176 power factor....

it was a top load though.. flat primer