[WmCF]

Looking to buy my first Limited gun and thought I'd go with .40 caliber but I've been reading many posts by people that say they don't like the "snappy" recoil and they find it more difficult to shoot than .45.
If this is true why are so many Limited guns chambered for .40 and it seems to be a popular round for competition?

[cnote]

WmCF, on Apr 12 2009, 08:49 AM, said:

Looking to buy my first Limited gun and thought I'd go with .40 caliber but I've been reading many posts by people that say they don't like the "snappy" recoil and they find it more difficult to shoot than .45.
If this is true why are so many Limited guns chambered for .40 and it seems to be a popular round for competition?

.40 is the minimum caliber, and the mag holds more rounds than .45.
Less mag changes = quicker times.

[TM262]

.45 ACP double stacks can be a little harder to get to run reliably with 14-16 rounds. I had a Para in .45ACP that ran, but there a many that don't.

[Jman]

Mag capacity and with correct grip and stance it handles superbly.


Jim

[Flexmoney]

Don't worry about any reported "snappiness".

What you are hearing about there is mostly due to bullet weight. 40 guns typically run bullets that weigh either 165g, 180, or 200g...180g being the most popular. 45 guns typically run 200g or 230g (though some run 185g or so).

Loaded to the same Power Factor*, a heavier bullet will give a more "lazy and rolling" recoil feel. While a lighter bullet will have the gun recoil a bit more...well...snappy.

Probably 90% of the Limited shooter run a 40. And, 85% of those run them with 180g bullets. They work...well.


* Power Factor is a bullets velocity multiplied by it's weight (and then divided by 1,000 just to make the numbers look simple). For instance, our sport requires that a load makes 165+ Power Factor to be considered for Major scoring.

A 180g bullet would need to be going at a speed of 917 feet per second (fps) to make Major ( 180 x 917 = 165060, divide by 1,000 and you get 165.060). A 200g bullet would need to be going 825fps...

[lugnut]

Oh one other thing. Although many of us like "less snappie" guns for this sport. Most of the nice limited guns, along with help from the shooter, come right back on target pretty quick anyway. The more I shoot, the more I realize it's not the gun or ammo's fault.... it's mine, it's just easier to blame the gun/ammo.

[jkrispies]

lugnut, on Apr 12 2009, 07:46 AM, said:

Oh one other thing. Although many of us like "less snappie" guns for this sport. Most of the nice limited guns, along with help from the shooter, come right back on target pretty quick anyway. The more I shoot, the more I realize it's not the gun or ammo's fault.... it's mine, it's just easier to blame the gun/ammo.

+1

99% of my shooting is done with a .45acp, but I've tried a variety of bullet weights in that caliber and can attest to this statement. Once the adrenaline is flowing under the clock, I can't tell the difference between my 172pf 200 grainers or my 185pf 230 grainers. It's just going bang, and I'm just aiming.

[bkeeler]

I kind of like the snappiness of the 40. Recoil impulse is quick and over with.



BK

[G-ManBart]

Get hooked up with your local club, talk with some of the shooters and ask around to shoot some Limited guns. Once people find out you're looking to buy/build you're going to have folks literally handing guns and ammo to you to try.

Shoot a typical Limited gun in .40 with decent handloads or competition specific ammo (like Atlanta Arms) and there's pretty much no way you're going to think they feel snappy. I've let people at work try mine and they all say it feels like a pop gun.

Most of the folks talking about "snappy .40s" are comparing single stacks and even there the difference is very minor. My wife is quite petite (size 2) and she put about 250 rounds of .40 major through my single stack the last time we shot together....no way it's snappy if she can shoot that much without a problem (has tiny hands too).

Try one, you'll like it

[WmCF]

THANKS to all! EXCELLENT info! Can't be any more "snappy" than my Glock 19 shooting cheap Blazer ammo; now that's snappy!
I had pretty much decided on an STI 2011 in .40 but read a bunch of posts on other forums by people hating the .40 round. I'm new to this and still learning and I appreciate all the informative replies.
True that as soon as the match timer goes off I tend never to notice the recoil..........
Cheers.

[fourtrax]

What are you doing on other forums? You are now on "THE FORUM", IMHO!!!

[steel1212]

fourtrax, on Apr 12 2009, 06:49 PM, said:

What are you doing on other forums? You are now on "THE FORUM", IMHO!!!

For practical shooting there is no "Other forums". Ask your questions here and get answers from some of the best shooters in the world.

With that being said, get a STI in .40. If your worried about the recoil get a edge with some heavy parts and as you shoot more and more your more than likely to trim away the fat and have a light gun. I started out with a para and a tungsten guide rod=HEAVY! My current STI eagle probably weighs in around 34-35oz or so if I had to guess.

[ima45dv8]

As far as real opinions about firearms and techniques, this is the place. I'll shoot 8-10,000 rounds this year just in matches (that's about all the practice I get), and that makes me a guppy compared to many people here.

Folks here don't just shoot or test or break guns; they wear 'em out.

[G-ManBart]

ima45dv8, on Apr 12 2009, 10:02 PM, said:

Folks here don't just shoot or test or break guns; they wear 'em out.

Oh, you just had to go and write that It got me wondering so I just counted how many rounds I shot between today and Friday....656 plus or minus just a couple. I have an excuse though, I'm breaking in the new M&P Pro and have to shoot something else in between while it's cooling off!

Edit cause I can't type tonight!

This post has been edited by G-ManBart: 12 April 2009 - 10:35 PM

[WmCF]

Again, THANKS everyone for all of the useful replies. I now know that I have found THE forum!
Upon further reflection I realize my question was a little silly. I could have asked, "many if not most experienced Limited shooters use .40 but some less experienced shooters have told me they don't like it; should I be concerned?"
Pardon me, but I'm a new shooter.
Cheers.

[Putty]

I like the edge in .40 as it is fairly cheap to load vs. a .45. I had my slide lightened and run about a 170 Pfactor.

[sargenv]

And if it's too snappy, you could always load your 40 to minor and then work your way up to major as you gain experience. Personally I like 40 minor but then since I shoot a revolver... my 610 hardly moves with minor loads and I can get a faster follow up shot..

[Graham Smith]

Here is a gem of wisdom from a friend of mine. A lot of people judge "recoil" based on shooting factory ammo in a stock gun. That's a far cry from shooting well tuned match ammo in a well tuned match gun.

Because .40 is so popular, you can find a wealth of information on formulas for loads for almost any gun in common use and a wealth of information on tuning that gun as well.

[SIG shooter]

In terms of economy, once fired .40 brass is dirt cheap and easy to find vs. .45. Bullets are cheaper as well, making .40 a little cheaper to shoot. A used .40 STI Edge or Eagle is a good pistol to start off with.

[GrumpyOne]

I don't shoot Limited, but Open with an old .40 Springfield P9 Factory Comp. Everyone above is right, "snappy" goes away when you are shooting in a match.

[Joe4d]

.40 is the ultimate game round. Most can be loaded from a low of 130 pf for IDPA where the reduced capacity versus the 9mm doesnt hurt. To 200 pf for bowling pins. Many .40s will do this with no change to the gun some only require a $7 recoil spring swap out. For USPSA Limited if you show up with anything but a .40 tou are playing catch up.

[mildot1]

I didn't know a lot about the .40 S&W but just went with what My buddy told me. STI Edge in >40- I love that pistol!!!!!!!

[Scot45601]

I started limited with a Glock 24 then a Para and now I will be getting a STI Edge this winter.All have been in .40 and love shooting it.

[Joe4d]

What people ?....................
You need to ak your self that when getting answers to a question, many novices to shooting or shooting sports assume all shooting is the same or assume someone with experience in one aspect of shooting is an expert on all aspects. There are alot of good shooters out that that have never competed so really have no idea what makes a good limited gun or not, unfortunately these people wont admit they are clueless and spout out there opinions like they are the gospel. A little advice, if you are looking for gun recommendations ask people that actually do what you want to do.

[AriM]

I often wonder about .40 as well....but it is easy to manage (recoil), slightly less expensive than .45 and will make major power....also a few more rounds in the mags...in limited 10 it makes no sense to me, but I am also in California....so my mags are already capped, by some silly law....you know if us californians were allowed to have 14 round mags, we would go insane and shoot everything in sight (with those 4 extra rounds).....