65 replies to this topic

[ausshooter]

Did anyone ever make any extended capacity basepads for the white highcap 40 or 9 hk mags? I thought arrendondo did but i can't find anything.

The Arredondo baseplates for Glock 17's fit on the highcap 40/9 mags. The +4 is not USPSA legal. The +3 is and adds 2 comfortably, 3 will spread the feedlips. The +3 will slide on with a little convincing, the +4 requires a little bit of filing. The replacement springs have to be cut to fit on the HK follower, but they work like a charm...

[PINMAN44]

Thanks Auss.

[PINMAN44]

Do you have any pics of your work?

[19852]

I met some Border Patrol types at a recent match here in So. TX. They use the USPc .40 LEM and had nothing but good things to say about it. If you do your job it will perform well.

[ausshooter]

You can see the mags stick out a bit from the bottom of the magwell, but they lock up solid. There is no play at all.

[konkapot]

Also Entreprise Arms makes extensions for these mags; not super durable, but another option.

The Arredondo pads were 100% reliable and durable for me.

Border Patrol uses the P2000 pistol.

FY42385

[dukeyjoe]

Thanks for the info Aus.

[FF1063]

HK45 non-competitively.

I think people shoot HK pistols primarily because they are cool,

I shoot H&K because I get so dang frustrated with other brands that are unreliable or inaccurate or both. Love 1911's, but for a trouble free, combat accurate .45, you can't beat H&K

[pangris]

I firmly believe that Glock, S&W revolvers, and 1911s form the holy trinity - but the HK competiton LEM trigger is exceptional, the accuracy is fantastic, the reliability is as good as machines get... I'm seriously considering shooting a USP 9mm with a comp LEM trigger in production, and there is no doubt in my mind I will do as well as I would have with my old G34.

Edited by pangris, 04 October 2009 - 11:53 AM.

[ausshooter]

I firmly believe that Glock, S&W revolvers, and 1911s form the holy trinity - but the HK competiton LEM trigger is exceptional, the accuracy is fantastic, the reliability is as good as machines get... I'm seriously considering shooting a USP 9mm with a comp LEM trigger in production, and there is no doubt in my mind I will do as well as I would have with my old G34.

From what I understand, the LEM trigger is not legal for production. It is for Limited though. I'm running my 40 w/the jetfunnel, 18 round mags, combat competition trigger (light LEM), and a CR speed rig in Limited and I feel that I'm fairly competitive. We'll see how I do at Area 4.

A

[pangris]

please do update.

[grayguns]

If you will indulge some reminiscing, I can tell you that the USP presented some intersting challenges when I was once again shooting for HK-USA, from '99 through '02. At first I ran an Expert .40 in Limited. That necessitated the development of some trick reduced-reset action work and a few tweaks to make the sights track and return faster and more consistently.

It IS possible to get really shootable triggers on USP's but it's not easy nor obvious. We eventually doped out a reliable system for this work that we still use today in our shop and I'll be happy to provide some advice on the subject if y'all wish.

The second challenge was that darned inconsistent muzzle flip and sight return of the USP Fullsize pistols. Everyone who saw my USP's commented on the high bore axis, and indeed they are a bit higheer than, say, a 1911. However, the dual-function recoil buffer is most of the problem; it makes the USP-F bounce like a jet-powered pogo stick compared to similar-leverage platofrms like the P226. It may theoretically increase durability (it's actual purpose) but it does nothing for rapid sight return, so we came up with two different methods for eliminating the thing. Take it out and spring thr gun appropriately, and the big USP will really start playing nicely. FWIW, I was sadly bemused when SIG put a similar buffer in the XFive. We get rid of those as well.

As for mags, I simply adapted STI 140's to my Experts. They ran really well, and were more durable than the funky "white" mags that tend to develop liner-adhesion and feedlip issues after a while. The only feeding issues I can recall with my Experts were due, I believe, to these mags after they started to spread and crap out.

These Experts were very accurate, though I ran BarSto's in mine most of the time since, as a true dinosaur, I shot Laser-Cast 185's in competition and these bullets wouldn't group well from the stock barrel. From the BarSto, my load of 4.4gr. Universal and a Laser-Cast 185 40/1911 bullet would give me under 3" at fifty and was way soft.

When I made the Production team prior to the WS in 2002, I was already having serious problems with the nerves and joints in my hands and arms that ultimately compelled me to retire from competition in 2004. (Beki says I should have been a male model rather than a gunmaker or shooter. It seems I'm not cut out for manual labor, and the fragments in my right hand didn't help either.) That's relevant here because I literally, and I mean this, could NOT fire a stock USP9F in DA mode with my right hand. I had never cared a rat's ass about DA until then, but suddenly I had three months to dope out how to make that work for me and train up as best I could. Desperation is a great motivator. My USP9F action was very competitive, it ran perfectly and I shot it well. My son Miles carries that USP on duty now.

The original USP's, however optimized, still have some handicaps. They are flippy, they can be breakage-prone (including sear springs, firing pins and trigger bars), and they aren't necessarily as ergonomic as other options for many shooters. HK corrected many of these issues with the P30, though they introduced a few new issues as well. Still, it may offer an edge over it's predecessors. It's ergos are way ahead overall, the bore axis is lower, the action is better and they won't lilely break parts as readily. I still think the standard original USP9F, with some tweaks, would be a reasonably competitive Production gun today, and is arguably faster to load than the P30, but the P30 will beat it in a Bill Drill contest every time. We are seeing more of the latter these days in our shop.

I hope this helps frame the discussion a bit. Thanks.

-Bruce

Grayguns Inc. / grayguns.com

[MTU_327PC]

I shoot my USP9 for IDPA and have shot some steel matches with it. I love it, but am in dire need of the jet funnel kit and some larger mags. I probably won't be bringing the gun farther than IDPA, but I'll never get rid of it. Put close to 15,000 down range in the last year since I've picked it up, and it'll eat anything. One jam, and it was low powered reload of mine. Gun definitely doesn't like lead. Like grayguns said, a barsto is probably the direction I'll go next with it. I'm not fond of how fast the gun shows holster wear, but in all reality I use it. I'm not much of a safe queen gun guy.

[DarthMuffin]

I just wanted to thank Bruce for his great post. Packed full of good info! Thanks.

[ausshooter]

The second challenge was that darned inconsistent muzzle flip and sight return of the USP Fullsize pistols. Everyone who saw my USP's commented on the high bore axis, and indeed they are a bit higheer than, say, a 1911. However, the dual-function recoil buffer is most of the problem; it makes the USP-F bounce like a jet-powered pogo stick compared to similar-leverage platofrms like the P226. It may theoretically increase durability (it's actual purpose) but it does nothing for rapid sight return, so we came up with two different methods for eliminating the thing. Take it out and spring thr gun appropriately, and the big USP will really start playing nicely. FWIW, I was sadly bemused when SIG put a similar buffer in the XFive. We get rid of those as well.

As for mags, I simply adapted STI 140's to my Experts. They ran really well, and were more durable than the funky "white" mags that tend to develop liner-adhesion and feedlip issues after a while. The only feeding issues I can recall with my Experts were due, I believe, to these mags after they started to spread and crap out.

Bruce,

Thank you very much for your input. There aren't too many of us out here trying to make those guns sing, but for those of us who do your experience is a great help.

I'm fascinated with your idea of replacing the recoil spring. I was always under the impression that one of its other purposes was to dampen the recoil. I do notice the bounce on the sights quite a bit more with the 45 than the 40, however I attributed that to a better grip on the gun and snappier recoil of the 40 round. What weight recoil spring did you find worked best with 40? Did you play with weights and your load at the same time, or did you find one and experiment with the other?

How many rounds did you get in your modified mags and did you use any basepads? The white mags with +2's are running well, but they will not hold the slide open reliably and the base pads do have to be modified to drop free.

Also, why did you choose the expert over the fullsize? Was that back when the 6" limited guns were the rage?

A

[ausshooter]

I firmly believe that Glock, S&W revolvers, and 1911s form the holy trinity - but the HK competiton LEM trigger is exceptional, the accuracy is fantastic, the reliability is as good as machines get... I'm seriously considering shooting a USP 9mm with a comp LEM trigger in production, and there is no doubt in my mind I will do as well as I would have with my old G34.

From what I understand, the LEM trigger is not legal for production. It is for Limited though. I'm running my 40 w/the jetfunnel, 18 round mags, combat competition trigger (light LEM), and a CR speed rig in Limited and I feel that I'm fairly competitive. We'll see how I do at Area 4.

A

Oh yeah, just as an update (and a little bragging!) I placed second in Limited B at Area 4 with the above rig this year.

A

[Mo Hepworth]

thanks for the great post Bruce. I loved my USP's in 9mm. I had a stainless with the match trigger and PSI sights. I am a righty, but I moved the lever for decocking to the right side so i could get my thumbs up high on the frame, (I felt the lever was in the way) I used this in production. I currently am shooting tanfoglio's, but have a P30-L. I am hoping for a P30-L -S. I am so used to using a thumb safety now that is actually feels awkward shooting pistols without a thumb safety. What do you think of the current recoil spring weight in the P30-L and the use of the buffer?

[Lumpy McSoo]

USP40 and USP9 are the most common I have seen in IDPA or USPSA matches. I used to shoot my USP45 in L10 but, I was riding the saftey/decocker and decocked the gun way too often. I can say that they work well and are very accurate.

Run what you have it just may work well for you.

a $10 detent plate for variant # 9 would have fixed that issue. the lever only acts as the safety in function for V9.

I have just shot a friend's HK 45. The only thing I didn't like is that sometimes while trying to thumb the safety down as on my 1911s I would decock the hammer and be left with a 20 ton double action trigger pull. I love the pistol but would never carry it in the configuration he has it in which is safety and also decocker. If I got this $10 detent plate, would that make this like the 1911 style safety with no decocker?

Sorry for my lack of knowledge, but I am a Glock and 1911 guy who just has ventured into the H&K "wow" realm.

Later, Lumpy.

[ausshooter]

USP40 and USP9 are the most common I have seen in IDPA or USPSA matches. I used to shoot my USP45 in L10 but, I was riding the saftey/decocker and decocked the gun way too often. I can say that they work well and are very accurate.

Run what you have it just may work well for you.

a $10 detent plate for variant # 9 would have fixed that issue. the lever only acts as the safety in function for V9.

I have just shot a friend's HK 45. The only thing I didn't like is that sometimes while trying to thumb the safety down as on my 1911s I would decock the hammer and be left with a 20 ton double action trigger pull. I love the pistol but would never carry it in the configuration he has it in which is safety and also decocker. If I got this $10 detent plate, would that make this like the 1911 style safety with no decocker?

Sorry for my lack of knowledge, but I am a Glock and 1911 guy who just has ventured into the H&K "wow" realm.

Later, Lumpy.

Yes

[Lumpy McSoo]

Thanks.

Now on to find where to get the plate and is it self installable?

Suggestions?

Simple or should I find a H&K certified smith?

Thanks for all of the help.

Later, Lumpy

[ausshooter]

You can call HK customer service and get it or anyone who stocks HK parts. If you want the safety on the non-ejection port side of the gun and only want safe/fire capabilities, you'll want the variant 9 detent plate. It is user installable, very very simple. Just push in the pin that holds it in slightly, pull the old one out, put the new one in, and push the pin back in place. It's a 3 second job.

[racine]

Thank you Bruce for many years of enjoyable shooting sessions with that USP Expert. It ran rings around that old Para built by that self proclaimed "...1911 master gunsmith west of the Miss..." I ran into in Denver. Your modifications last and work...

[700m1]

Another P7M13 in Production!!!

[SCfromNY]

Have to agree with the poster about "nice, HK, and trigger" in the same post. I did send my P2000 LEM to Bill Springfield and for $69 I now have a much better trigger.

[racine]

Hope that runs for you...

Edited by racine, 20 May 2010 - 09:41 PM.