[benos]

I hear that on the phone every day.

The first thing I say (after I don't know) is that one of the main advantages of reloading is that you can load much better ammo than you can buy. By experimenting with bullets, powders, and powder charges, you can come up with a nice, accurate, soft recoiling load that you'll enjoy shooting much more than whatever happens to be available in factory ammo.

But still, newcomers to reloading would still like to see some numbers.

Sometimes it comes down to the fact that you just can't find factory ammo to buy. Like with .223 for example. It seems like everyone's gearing up to load .223 nowadays.

I'd guess that for more expensive factory ammo, like 40, 45, and 44 Mag, and most all rifle cartridges, the savings would be significant.

But the most common caliber I hear for the "is it worth it to reload" question is for 9mm. Some tell me they can buy it for not much more than they can reload it for. And then on the other hand, I've been selling a lot of reloading equipment for 9mm lately. It's definitely one of the most common calibers I sell Dillon equipment for.

So any precise or ballpark figures would be appreciated, not just by me but for newcomers to reloading for years to come.
be

[Matt Cheely]

These are for top shelf match ammo.

9mm 147gr Montana Gold CMJ
$132 per K

40 S&W 180gr Montana Gold CMJ
$152 per K

Practice ammo

9mm 147gr Black Bullets International
$94 per K

40 S&W 180gr Black Bullets International
$111 per K

[Catfish]

http://handloads.com...oadingCosts.asp


Don't know if you've seen this, but it's a good resource for that kind of stuff...

[Steve J]

Here's my most recent data for 45 ACP. All prices are delivered.

Zero 230 gr FMJ - 2000 count @ $235.50, price per 50 - $5.89 (Roze Distribution)
Wolf Large Pistol Primers - 15,000 count @ $303.00, price per 50 - $1.01 (Wiedeners)
Tite-Group - 8 lb. @ $111.49, price per 50 - $0.44 (Sportsman's Warehouse)
Once fired, single headstamp, cleaned brass - 2000 count @ $109.87, price per 50 - $2.75 (GunBroker.com)

$10.09 per 50 rounds.

[IronEqualizer]

Steve J, on Dec 16 2008, 09:08 PM, said:

Here's my most recent data for 45 ACP. All prices are delivered.

Zero 230 gr FMJ - 2000 count @ $235.50, price per 50 - $5.89 (Roze Distribution)
Wolf Large Pistol Primers - 15,000 count @ $303.00, price per 50 - $1.01 (Wiedeners)
Tite-Group - 8 lb. @ $111.49, price per 50 - $0.44 (Sportsman's Warehouse)
Once fired, single headstamp, cleaned brass - 2000 count @ $109.87, price per 50 - $2.75 (GunBroker.com)

$10.09 per 50 rounds.

$7.34 after that initial brass purchase.

AL

[zhunter]

For reloading:

Tell them the more you shoot, the more you save!!!

[lugnut]

I do everything based on 1000:

Berrys 124gr RN bullets $77 shipped (MG CMJ are about the same cost in bulk)
Win primers $26
Win 231 powder ~$12
Brass- free, no reason you can't still find plenty free brass for 9mm- start saving eveything now

Cost/1000: $115

I can't find decent commercial loads for under $200/1000 around here. And like Brian said- you get to tune the loads the way you want- that's the most significant.

[JThompson]

The bottom line is you don't save a dime... you are just able to shoot more for the same price.

[Anon]

JThompson, on Dec 17 2008, 01:48 AM, said:

The bottom line is you don't save a dime... you are just able to shoot more for the same price.

EXACTLY!!!!

You won't save ANY money. In fact, you will most likely spend MORE. Reloading just helps you feed your habit, and shoot more. You will end up shooting as much as you can afford to, either way.

[boz1911]

Anon, on Dec 17 2008, 04:47 AM, said:

JThompson, on Dec 17 2008, 01:48 AM, said:

The bottom line is you don't save a dime... you are just able to shoot more for the same price.

EXACTLY!!!!

You won't save ANY money. In fact, you will most likely spend MORE. Reloading just helps you feed your habit, and shoot more. You will end up shooting as much as you can afford to, either way.

+ a zillion, reloading allows you to feed the monkey cheaper food...

[High Lord Gomer]

I had done a spreadsheet a while ago to see what it cost me to reload, but this prompted me to go back and add some other calculations to it. Specifically, how much I save per hour by reloading.



Basically, you enter data in the yellow boxes and it calculates the blue boxes. I found it interesting that I save about the same amount per hour doing .223 as I do 9mm.

If anyone wants the spreadsheet to fiddle with themselves, I put it at: http://themxtrack.co...adTracking2.xls

BTW, there is also space for tracking the performance of the loads but I must have misrecorded the Load 2 speed through the 92FS in the sample I have in the spreadsheet.

[safenate]

I'm with the guys above, I'm gonna spend ? dollars and reloading allows me more rounds per $. A few years ago one could load JHP MG 40 or 45 for under 10 cents per load, recycled brass. Now it costs that much for JHP 9mm reloads and 40/45 are about 12 cents each. You could save a bit more by going to cheaper primers or very minimal powder charges. Though not a regular 223 reloader, i just bought 3500 projos & 8 lbs of H335 to start. I save a bunch on 500 Mag reloads as well..

[MtBob]

for someone new to reloading, I always tell them you have to factor in the cost of the equipment as well. An investment into a 550 or 650 takes a few rounds before you start 'saving'.

Assuming you are buying components locally and not paying hazmat shipping, right now for .223;
2000 Montana Gold 55 gr FMJbt = $174.00 delivered
2000 Primers = @ $48.00
2000 once fired cases = $209
8lbs Accurate 2230 (I just scored some for) = $116.80 (will load @ 2333 rounds @ 24 gr per, so there is some left over)

comes to .266 / round
13.28 / 50 rounds
265.56 / 1000 rounds

If you factor in initial set up with a new press;
Basic Dillon 550 set up = $407
Dillon Dies = $ 63

Basic 650 set up = $530
Dies = $ 63

So cost vs buying commercial ammo (if you can find it) for ex. Midsouth has .223 listed from $21 - $28 / 50 rounds (but let's not include shipping, staying with the buy locally initial idea). That is @ .44 - .56 / round. Which is .18 - .30/round savings. To pay off the $470 for the basic 550, you need to load 2611 - 1566 rounds. To pay off the basic 650, 3294 - 1977 rounds. I don't think that is too bad. I know there is a lot of people in this forum that will load 3300 rounds easily in a year.

[prreed10]

JThompson, on Dec 17 2008, 12:48 AM, said:

The bottom line is you don't save a dime... you are just able to shoot more for the same price.

This is exactly what I tell everyone who asks me this question.

[Beans]

I have been called or refered to as a "Range Buzzard" as I collect, gether, glean, all the unclaimed, discarded, pistol brass I can obtain for the calibers I reload.

Over the years this had resulted in several .50 Cal ammo cans full of useable brass, which cuts my reloading cost greatly.

I also use a Magma Caster to cast all my bullets.

Now since the *cost of ammo has increased or in some cases become unavailable reloading has become very important.

Speer GDHP .44 Special is priced at $32.95 Plus tax for 20 rounds (Feb 4, 2009) and I can load 50 rounds for less then $15.00

It is costing me less then $.06 a round to load my 45 ACP, 40 S&W, 44 mag and .357's

Powder is running about $.02 a round. primers .025 @ that is $.045 cent a round without buying bullets. Lead/WW is now selling for $.20 a pound, (when you can find it) with an average weight of 200 grs per bullet you can get NLT 300 Bullets out of a pound of lead/WW.

As I am retired I don't count my labor.

If you start counting you time/labor reloading/ bullet casting then you should count your time while driving to the range, and then driving back, shopping for powder ETC.

[RePete]

How much money can I save by reloading?

The true answer is NONE!

Why? Because you will be shooting more.

More shooting is always good, yes?

[DrShooter]

Reloading is about half the cost for most "game" loads because the brass is about half the cost of a new round. You will shoot 5-10 times more, so "saving money" is not really a good concept. Plus, loading is meditating, so it's good for you.

More to the point if you don't reload for the game, you will have to buy pistols to match the ammo you can buy. For example, shooting single stack will mean .40 S&W not .45 ACP. Not that shooting .40 S&W is a bad thing or that shooting at a powerfactor of 210 is a disadvantage for everyone.

I think TGO has some words on his site on how to match your pistol designs to Winchester factory loads.

Some guns, like my .40 S&W STI, will like ammo loaded much longer than factory spec for getting the feed-problem statistics down.

[s.reese65]

well I get lead cast bullets for 72 a 1000 from a local maker for 45 acp, I bought the last box of 1000 large pistol primers at a gun show for 35 bucks (happened to been wolf primers), a pound of clays went for 22 bucks, brass is free ( some folks will leave anything) so maybe 115 a thousand, but if you figure in your initial cost of a dillon 650 with case feeder and dillon dies (around 900) then that first 1000 rounds sure is expensive, or add the 115 to 900.....but if you factor in store bought 1000 rounds of loaded ammo, it only takes a few hours of loading to break even (or get your 900 back in savings in load your own or buy at store), then from then on you'll be saving.

[albsch]

I just started reloading for both 9mm and 45 acp and was wondering this myself so I did the calculations to satisfy my curiosity.
For 45 ACP I am saving just under 50% off the last WWB I purchased. Here are my numbers...

1000 Precision Delta 230 gn RN 114.00 or .114 per bullet
1 pound WST powder $17.99 for 7000 grains or .003 per grain @5.2gn per round =.016 (Local purchase no hazmat)
Primers 25.00 per 1000 or .026 per primer (Local purchase no hazmat)
Brass no cost as I pick up everything I can.
Total cost per round 15.6 cents per round or $7.80 per box of 50.

The last time I purchased WWB is was 29.89 per box of 100 so this is $14.94 per 50 and reloading then saves me $7.14 per box. Obviously the above figures do not count the cost of the initial set up, but I consider that part of starting any new hobby and did not factor it in. It has been said in prior posts that you really do not save any money with this hobby and I can attest that this is true. I went from shooting a couple of boxes a week to easily shooting 4 or more boxes in 45acp alone and my homemade rounds are more accurate than the WWB.

[nazproperties]

I have never really saved any money reloading. I just end up shooting and enjoying it more.

[GrumpyOne]

nazproperties, on Mar 23 2009, 12:16 AM, said:

I have never really saved any money reloading. I just end up shooting and enjoying it more.

Plus, you don't have to worry about Walmart not having your favorite ammo!

[Classic_jon]

I am loading the .40 Montana Gold 155gr JHP's with V V N320 and CCI SPP and am at about .16 a bullet instead of the Blazer brass 180gr at about .25 a bullet. The cost of a Winchester White box around here right now is ....just silly... it is in the $0.40 a round range for it.....

The Blazer brass is not bad but my handloads are MUCH more accurate. I could probably cut my cost to about .12 or .14 a round by switching to titegroup or HP-38/231 but I like the feel of the N320 so, as long as I can find it I think I will keep tuning that load up

[Bongo Boy]

I've just started and initially, didn't see any savings at all. But, I was looking at purchasing bullets and brass from big-presence suppliers. My answer would be "it ranges from nothing at all to quite a bit". But, yesterday I ran the numbers for MY current situation, as follows:

1. Casting my own bullets, buying the lead online.
2. Buying once-fired brass from a couple of sources.
3. Retrieving as much range brass as possible.
4. Buying powder and primers online and minimizing overhead charges (hazardous mat'l & shipping).

The costs associated with all the above, right now, come out as follows:

Bullets. I buy lead online at 1.25/lb shipped and cast 255 gr bullets from it. Cost per bullet is about 0.05 each, assuming 2% waste.
Primers. Amortizing ALL the hazardous charge to just the 5000 primers ordered with powder, about 0.034 each.
Powder. Assuming an 8 lb order placed with the primers above and loading 3.0 gr per round, about 0.01 per round.
Brass. I've paid $68/1000 for 2000 cases, and just bought 2000 more for $105...so 0.05 to 0.07 each, reused 10 times = 0.006 each

TOTAL rounded up is about 0.10 a round...less than 1/5 of what the cheapest .45 ACP ammo costs in the gun shop right now ($28/box of 50).

I've spent about $700 on all the reloading gear I need to comfortably pound out 50 rds of ammo during a 15-minute visit to the garage, so the payback math is something like "how many rounds of ammo, at .10 per round, do I need to load to pay for $700 of equipment--that is, to save $700 in ammo costs?"

(.56 - .10) = .46/rd savings. $700.00/$0.46 = 1,521

This discounts the fact that the brass has NOT been reused 10 times. If I simply add in the actual cost of the brass used, as though it would only be used once, then my ammo is about 0.15 per round, and the numbers are:

(.56 - .15) = .41/rd savings. $700.00/0.41 = 1,710

So...for .45 ACP loaded using bullets you cast yourself and once-fired brass you pay for, plus using powder and primers that you buy in bulk for a single hazmat/shipping fee, you can pay for 'lower end' reloading gear in about a week or two of casual reloading. This ignores the cost of bullet lube, but does not ignore the cost the lube/sizer and die, which is included in the $700.

My first 80 lbs of lead was 'free', as I gathered it in about 2 hours at a nearby public range. That's 2,000 bullets at no cost except time--I won't be able to continue doing that for the forseeable future, and so have included the cost of mail-order lead in the math.

This is somewhat time-consuming to understate it, but I find the monotonous repetition of handloading akin to knitting...except anything you knit will cost far more than anything you can buy ready-made and I look far more manly handloading than I do when knitting, and I hate sweaters.

Compare these numbers to those above from Dec 2008 and it makes handloading very attractive, at least for the kind of stuff I'm loading where big brass, big loads and a big press aren't needed. At $.50/rd for .45 ACP and $0.75/rd and more for rifle cartridges, I'd simply have to find another hobby. If Walmart ever actually HAD any ammo, it would still over 3 times the cost of my handloads, and I'd not have the little "punkin' chucker" loads I'm now enjoying.

This post has been edited by Bongo Boy: 28 August 2009 - 09:38 AM

[AriM]

I calculated that my total investment for loading MATCH grade 45 acp (far better than anything I could buy) would be recouped after 6550 rounds...I can produce a quality of ammuntition, that I simply could not get anywhere else for about .15 each

projectile: 0.09 (0.03 if I cast my own)
primer: 0.025 (let's hope they stay there or go back down, not likely)
powder : 0.00875 (less than a cent for practice, about a cent for major PF)
brass : free (unless it's for match/home defense, then 0.13 seems fair)
equipment to load and cast : $2500-$3000

here is the thing though....it's not even fair to compare handloads to factory....everyone here knows that their ammo trumps any other ammo they can get...we each build ammo specific to our gun and or needs....

If you factor in the time spent to learn/research and actually develop and build...well how much is your time worth?? If you make good money on an hourly basis....you will save NOTHING...NOTHING!!!!!!

now let's look at how much more we shoot when reloading....I think everyone here shoots as much as they can possibly afford to....so even if you were spending $200 a month on factory ammo, you would still be spending $200 a month on handloads (if that was your budget)

the cost savings is NOTHING, I promise you absolutely NOTHING....and of course you assume the liability of making an inherently dangerous product...no matter how safe you are...sooner or later you will get a squib or double charge or blow out a tube of primers...so factor in the damage to your gun and damage to your workspace and gear...and the possibility of injury....

seriously, you can't even compare the 2....if someone was to ask me "how much will I save"....and it was my business to know and sell them on reloading....I would generate a pamphlet (online) that they could calculate their own cost basis with...that way you could just refer them to that and they can do the math themselves....also post a disclaimer about the risks and the possible pitfalls....it will weed out the guys looking to save a buck (who are going to haggle with you and bug you over their short loading career), who are just going to quit doing it anyhow....the guys who are dead set on loading for accuracy and the ability to shoot what they want, already know that they are going to buy reloading gear at some point....and pay whatever it costs to do what they have in mind...

MHO...

This post has been edited by AriM: 16 December 2009 - 05:08 AM

[G-ManBart]

AriM, on Dec 16 2009, 07:07 AM, said:

I calculated that my total investment for loading MATCH grade 45 acp (far better than anything I could buy)

Any time I see people say stuff like that I think that the person saying it needs to look for other sources of ammo or they've got some really oddball gun It generally isn't possible for the home hobbyist, even a serious one with the best equipment and years of experience, to load ammo that touches the quality (from an absolute sense) of what the factories are capable of producing. The only thing we can do "better" is tune the load to our gun and/or our purpose. If we sent our gun to them, and let them do their thing, they'd be able to come up with a better performing load than we could.

A lot of that is in the actual machinery we use and the limitations involved with it...and progressive presses are about the worst in that regard. Factory ammo loaded on a machine that has a fixed station for each function is going to be more precise than even a single stage press. I recently loaded up some 9mm to the most exacting precision I can get without going crazy. Loaded on my turret press using a Redding Competition Seating die, same lot brass, same lot bullets I still get a couple thousandths OAL variation (like .002+/-). I grabbed a box of Atlanta Arms 9mm and measured about twenty of them....not even a thousandth variation. Now, that particular ammo may not prove the most accurate in any one particular gun, but that goes back to tuning, not actual quality.

AriM, on Dec 16 2009, 07:07 AM, said:

equipment to load and cast : $2500-$3000

That's a pretty high number really. Even if somebody jumps in and buys a pretty expensive press like a 650 ($800 for everything) they can get all the other stuff required to load and cast and still be at $2500 or less....and a lot less if they're reasonably careful. R,