[conrad]

I would like to get the oppinion from the Ro's out there. If you where to work a Major match, what would you feel you should be compted for. And if the match fee is $85 or $90 how would you feel about the staff that works for 2 days still paying a match fee but at a discounted rate of $25. This question came up at one of our board meeting and I told them I would put it on the forum to get an answer.

[Chris Keen]

Hotel room for the RO's who are not local, of course. Free match fee would be nice, since those RO's are busting their butts to make sure all the other shooters have a great match experience.

[mscott]

I think RO's should shoot for free. It would be nice if there is enough local help to not pay hotel rooms, but even some of your regulars have a 2 hour drive. I would guess that gasoline will be going up again, so that puts a pretty good expense on your RO's that have to drive very far. I don't understand the entire budget you need to put on this sort of match, but would you really gain that much by charging staff to shoot?

[Franklin D Wolverton]

For our sectional next year I am planning on:

Waived match fee if they shoot Friday and work both days... discounted fee if they work one shoot one. (75/40)
$25 per day perdiem (up to 3 days)
Lunch on work days
T-Shirt

[Throwin Lead]

Larry Houck, the MD for Summer Blast does an excellent job of taking care of his staff. Full timers have their room paid for during the event (double occupancy). He uses a Holiday Inn Express that serves a continental breakfast, that's one meal paid for, provides lunch at the match and you are on your own for dinner all nights but one. He holds a staff banquet with food and prizes. Larry has said he is one of the few MD's that has a waiting list for RO's on a major match that costs $75 to shoot. The RO's shoot for free on Thursday.



Mike

[kimel]

There's at least one other long thread on this around here somewhere. Might want to try a search.

Bare minimum is match fee, lunch and cold drinks (sports drinks, not soda). Compensation for gas and/or hotel is highly recommended. And it goes on up from there.

The old adage of "you get what you pay for" tends to apply universally and I rather doubt match staff is an exception to that rule.

At Area 1 last year they comped match fee and double-occupancy hotel room and gave you a couple TechWear shirts and still had a bit of a tough time getting enough staff.

With travel costs so high and portfolios sucking wind I suspect it will be even harder to staff matches (let alone fill matches) this next year.

[BSeevers]

Franklin D Wolverton, on Nov 8 2008, 12:43 PM, said:

For our sectional next year I am planning on:

Waived match fee if they shoot Friday and work both days... discounted fee if they work one shoot one. (75/40)
$25 per day perdiem (up to 3 days)
Lunch on work days
T-Shirt

I would consider this a minimum.
People are giving 10 or so hours a day for multiple days.
Frankly as discussed many times before, this is the only time I work for so little.

[joseywales]

BSeevers, on Nov 9 2008, 09:58 AM, said:

Franklin D Wolverton, on Nov 8 2008, 12:43 PM, said:

For our sectional next year I am planning on:
Waived match fee if they shoot Friday and work both days... discounted fee if they work one shoot one. (75/40)
$25 per day perdiem (up to 3 days)
Lunch on work days
T-Shirt

I would consider this a minimum.
People are giving 10 or so hours a day for multiple days.
Frankly as discussed many times before, this is the only time I work for so little.

+1

[FranDoc]

In order:
1. Match fee comp'ed -- completely
2. Hydration -- yes, sports drinks and H2O, maybe having a 'staff' pot of coffee available first thing in the AM, not pop/soda - and lunch. I'm OK with breakfast & dinner being on my own.
3. 'Staff' shirt -- so that attendees & shooter can ID a range/match official when they need one
4. Lodging, or transportation compensation ('gas $$')

That can be prorated if somebody works for part of a 3-day match (staff shoots on Friday, competitor shoot Sat & Sun). If somebody is part of the set-up/clean-up crew, they deserve a HUGE thank-you and everything other than dinner should be provided for them.

This post has been edited by FranDoc: 09 November 2008 - 03:45 PM

[Franklin D Wolverton]

I guess I should have added "hydration" as well. Thats something I do at every match, so I didn't think to put it in the bennies.

Yes... I believe what I am offering is the minimum as well. Our match hotel is going to be about $50... so the per diem would cover half of that a day.

I have a budget... and this is what I could afford

I also forgot to add that the RO's and staff will have their own prize. All the competitors will be asked to pick the CRO/RO that they thought best exemplified the RO creed... (obviously done by blind vote). The winner will get some kind of decent prize (I am hoping for a firearm for each... but I don't know what we will have at the prize table yet).

Frank

[Flexmoney]

In 2007, I worked a half-dozen or more Major matches.

They all included:

- Basic hotel (2 to a room) for the traveling staff
- Staff shirt (not a "match" shirt)
- match fee
- Lunch at the range

That seems pretty standard. Over the years, I only recall one major match that didn't include all of the above, and they weren't able to keep staff interested in coming to volunteer. They no longer have a big match.

[Ron Rodgers]

The difference between a great match and a "not-so-good" match is largely due to the staff. At most majors, they are there for 4 days or so, putting in long days to make everyone else's match safe and enjoyable. You can't attract or keep quality staff if you don't treat them well.

What Flex mentioned is a "standard" package. To his list, I would add drinks on the range, and a portion of the donated prizes held back for a staff drawing.

[lim10]

There has been a good discussion regarding the compensation for working a match. If Conrad is going to share this with the board at his range, maybe we should have a little discussion about what it takes to put on a quality match with quality staff.

Match setup - for the state matches it usually takes two days to set up. A lot of the staff will be taking two days off work in order to help with set up. Then they will shoot one day and work one or two more days running other competitors. If things go very well, the majority of the match can be torn down and put away before these staffers head home. This involves folks working late at the range (the night before they have to go back to work).

To run a stage you need to be a certified range officer. Range officers complete a two day class (on their own) and also complete a recertification anually. Chief range officers and range masters require even more formal training.

There is a lot of hard work that goes into putting on a level 3 match. If there is little/nothing to reward the hard work, then what's the point? Keep in mind that other clubs may understand this a little better and treat staff appropriately. If Conrads club does not want to reciprocate, it may be very difficult to get staff to sign up.

[kimel]

The long and short of all this generally comes down to budget.

The most common thing seems to revolve around "we can't raise the match fee...it has been $xx for 10 years." Okay, what else has NOT gone up in cost in 10 years? There is also some sort of mythical glass ceiling at $100 for match fees.

The fact of the matter is that you owe it to the competitors to put on a good match and you need to have good, happy staff as part of that equation. If you want to keep the budget under reasonable levels then something has to give. Seems like the first thing that hits the old chopping block is including lunch/shirt/hat in the match fee and the second is starting to cut back on compensation for the staff.

Seems to me that all too often the match fee is set first and the budget forced to work within these constraints no matter how unreasonable this might be. Instead, figure out what it will cost to produce the match your club wants to produce, divide by the number of competitors you can REASONABLY expect, round to the nearest $5 mark and that is your match fee.

How many matches have you heard of or even been to where folks start talking about "boy, this match sure isn't what it used to be" and then go on to list all the things that have gone downhill. Now, how many of those matches have increased match fees to match inflation?

Think about it.

[Flexmoney]

(a little insider info...)

No budget issues here. This particular match is somewhat turn-key (that's an exaggeration, but it is established...at this location).

It's a money-maker. The USPSA monthly program is a money maker. The club, itself, is sitting on a large pile on money.

[kimel]

I was just speaking in general terms, not about any specific match.

[FullRace]

Conrad,

I worked most every major match last summer which included Summer Blast and A6. Both of these matches are 8 to 10 hour drives. I also worked major matches within a 2 to 4 hour drive. All the matches had the following:

Staff shot free.
Official Shirt (Not match shirt)
Hotel Room (Two to a room or half paid if you wanted your own room)
Free Lunch (Most of staff hotels had free breakfast)
Some kind of staff prizes (some matches better than others)
CRO/RO do not do stage setup or tear down.
1 CRO and 2 certified RO per stage or you get some grumpy ROs
Separate cold water provided for Staff--some had Gaterade etc. Better than just water IMHO.

The following were at some of the matches not all;
Pizza night + .
Full staff provided dinner one night at range with
The CRO/RO put in 10 to 12 hour days and bust ass all day. A well run match is a must!

In addition if I had to drive more than 30 minutes to work the match as CRO/RO, I would not be working it without a hotel room.

Hope this helps.