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Modified trigger bar nose (pics)


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#1 WARDOG

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Posted 27 October 2008 - 12:08 PM

Following JoeD threads about glock trigger jobs, I half-assed attempted to modify the trigger bar nose, grinding it in order to have a better trigger pull.

First, define what I like in a trigger pull:

First and foremost for me a short reset is mandatory, second a crisp striker release, and third a lower pull weight.

I looked hard and for long at the position of the trigger bar nose, when it's in the relax position, I.E. when rest above the connector raised step (sorry didn't have a name for that part).

I grinded some material in order to make the trigger bar nose reset in fire position earlier than before, basically you have to alter the top curve making it less round (please excuse me for my horrible engrish..).

I put a dremel upside down in a vise, with the grinding wheel perpendicular to the ground, marked the zone I wanted to grind with a felt marker, and proceeded to make a very light pass with sanding drum

BEWARE, have a strong light, and make very light contact with the grinding wheel, I learned this the hard way, I ruined a trigger bar grinding to the point that the striker was not released by the nose, with another trigger bar.

The procedure I took was the following:

-mark the zone of nose that is above connector angled step with a felt marker, fine tip.

-put the nose in contact with the grinding wheel, do a light pass trying to alter the curve in order to remove material from the point you marked. Try to do the pass in order to preserve the curve, don't do a radical angle, otherwise trigger pull increase.

-above all, A LIGHT PASS.

-reassemble, don't pay attention to the gritty pull, but to the reset.

-continue to do so until you have a short reset of your liking, I do not want to have a shorter reset than 1.8mm.

-stone true, and mirror polish the nose.

-done.

this is a trigger bar I did for my self defense G19 after Flexmoney point me VERY CORRECTLY (thanks flex!) on the possibility of short stroking my self defense gun after being accustomed to my competition G34 that has a very short reset.



pic:

Posted ImagePosted Image

another one:

Posted ImagePosted Image

My stock G19 has 4.4mm reset. Trigger pull 4.58lbs with 3.5 connector and 4lbs striker spring

With modified trigger bar it went 2.00mm reset with a trigger pull of 3.5lbs C-R-I-S-P.

So far I'm very satisfied. My competition g34 had a similar work done and it has 2.00 lbs trigger pull with 1.9mm reset, with Ti striker and a trapper striker spring (3lbs).

Hope it helps.

Edited by WARDOG, 29 October 2008 - 03:28 AM.


#2 jobob

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Posted 27 October 2008 - 02:18 PM

That helps a lot! Thanks!

I was trying to picture Joe D's modified trigger bar nose in my feeble mind, but your pictures bring it into focus (small pun). ;)
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#3 mpolans

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Posted 27 October 2008 - 06:28 PM

Thanks for the pictures! It's nice to see someone actually posting pics . . . word descriptions alone can be kind of vague.

What was your method for so precisely measuring the reset distance?
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#4 WARDOG

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Posted 28 October 2008 - 03:38 AM

Thanks everyone, I'm glad to help.

Reset mesurement is very simple, I mark with a very fine crayon white pencil some fine lines on the trigger guard bottom.

One in trigger forward position, to mark pretravel distance, one with striker released (trigger to the rear), and another one in the position where the trigger is when, with the trigger pressed I rack the slide and let trigger go forward until reset is done (audible click).

The last part is tricky because you want to mark the exact position where trigger is when sear reset.

It's not the most precise method, but is more than accurate to show improvements.

I will post pics when I return home!

#5 VegasOPM

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Posted 28 October 2008 - 11:00 AM

Well thanks to misplaced confidence due to your success, I was able to ruin a trigger bar. :blink: I got the reset down to very little, but the trigger doesn't always trip now with the 3.5# connector. When I put the 5# connector back in, the striker releases- but it is the weirdest trigger ever. Tons of slop followed by a very short- but heavy- release and almost no reset. It feels like I am flexing the trigger itself to get the release. :blush:

Oh well, back to the drawing board. Thankfully I have 8 Glocks and I was playing with my old Limited gun- which doesn't get used right now. It has been the recipient of a bunch of experiments and trials- most failures. Of course, that gives me an excuse to buy the Glockworx piece. B)
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#6 WARDOG

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Posted 28 October 2008 - 02:35 PM

actually trigger pull measured while keeping my g19 in a padded vice, is 3.12 lbs with a lyman digital gauge.

It seems that the OEM 3.5 connector did best for me. Reset with lone wolf connector was heavier and mushier.

#7 WARDOG

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Posted 29 October 2008 - 03:43 AM

I'm sorry for your bar, bro, I apologize, maybe I must have been more detailed in my initial post.

So, here we go, a more detailed view of the entire process:

First you have to strip your glock, and pushing connector tab toward mag well, engage disconnector.

You have to carefully mark the position where the tip of the angled connector contacts the nose. That point is where you have to BEGIN grinding to alter the nose curve, removing material in order to make disconnector clik sooner than before. If you grind PAST this point, the connector would not be engaged by the trigger bar, so be very precise and very careful. I use a red ink felt pencil.

In this pic you can see a stock trigger bar with 3.5 connector (glock OEM).

The yellow line mark the exact point you don't want to alter, note that you have a lots of steel over the connector, that is the amount of metal that you want to bypass in order to have a shorter reset.

Posted ImagePosted Image

In this pic, you can see the trigger moved forward just before the disconnector clicks into position and the trigger bar nose begins it's downward movemente. The yellow lines mark the amount of travel done by the trigger bar. Quite a bit uhm?

Posted ImagePosted Image

#8 WARDOG

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Posted 29 October 2008 - 03:49 AM

Ok, let's see the stock trigger bar from above:

Posted ImagePosted Image

The most difficult things to do is to alter the curve of the trigger bar nose in order to remove material, but preserve the angle of trigger bar downward movemente. If you grind at the wrong angle, you will have a much heavier trigger pull.

I'm not an engineer so I figured out the curve by imagination, so to speak, but the angle I did was quite apt to the job, in the end.

Another upward view of the stock assembly:

Posted ImagePosted Image

#9 WARDOG

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Posted 29 October 2008 - 04:08 AM

Now that you have marked the exact point where to grind it's time to put the dremel on use.

If you try to use a drill press with a sanding drum, you will have your field of view blocked by the drill and harbor, much better to use a dremel as it was an upside down lathe.

Put the dremel upside down on a vice, use an air bubble gauge to have it perpendicular, and try to have the trigger bar perfectly perpendicular to the grinding wheel as possible.

A tip: if you have an ultra fine scribe, you can mark the connector angle on the trigger bar nose when it's assemblend in gun, this way you will have a visual reference of the connector angle. It's much safer in order to grind a correct angle. I didn't do it the first time, and everything come out ok two times (for two bars), but the next three were ruined, because I overdo the curve in order to have the shortest reset possible (lesson learned the hard way, still much behind the JoeD drawer...;) )

Pic of my redneck grinding assembly:

Posted ImagePosted Image

That is the worst part..just a kiss of the well worn sanding drum, reassembly..check..grind some more.

I've reached a state where the frame pin went in position by itselves, I swear I heard my g19 frame saying "another one, and I'll melt by myself, dude.."

IF..everytghin went well, you will finally reach something like that:

Posted ImagePosted Image

Material over connector is gone, curve is lowered but you have a positive engagement on the upper part of the connector. A slight push forwar of the trigger bar, reset the disconnector. Check the nose for burrs, stone true (actually I used abrasive paper over a small file, glock steel is too hard for stoning..I used 400/600/800/100/1200 grit, then buffed with rouge polish) and reassemble.

Edited by WARDOG, 29 October 2008 - 04:10 AM.


#10 WARDOG

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Posted 29 October 2008 - 04:19 AM

Another view of the modified trigger bar:

Posted ImagePosted Image

NOW..you have to gauge your reset:

As I've previously said, mark with a white pencil the forward trigger position, and the rearward one, then, with the trigger in rear position, rack the slide (check three times if unloaded, of course) with trigger pressed and let move forward until connector clicks, then mark with pencil. Now you have three lines, the distance between the rearward two is the reset distance.

Pic of my stock G26, with everything OEM (3.5 connector)

Posted ImagePosted Image

(note very fine stippling, frame ridges removed and undercut trigger guard. Those modifications were done to control the little glock more efficently under stress)

The stock reset is 4.8mm, very long, prone to short stroking for me, having been accustomed to my competition g34 that has shorter reset.

#11 WARDOG

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Posted 29 October 2008 - 04:27 AM

Now reset is marked on my modified g19:

Posted ImagePosted Image

Measurements are difficult but you can visually see that reset is considerably shorter. My digital caliper says 1.9 mm reset, but I think it's more like 2.00, however the felt reset is amazing, crisp, VERY short.

Trigger pull was 3.12 lbs on a lyman pull gauge, on my stock g26 it's 4.00 lbs with more than double the reset distance.

Here you can see the stock 26 with modified 19 together:

Posted ImagePosted Image


Phwew...done with the pics, hope it helps, When I return home from work I will do some measurements on modified trigger bar, and will post.

Thanks to all for viewing, any critique will be greatly appreciated.

#12 mjohns930

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Posted 31 October 2008 - 07:16 AM

Thanks for the pics and the accuracy of your information. I have read that Glock trigger post by JoeD but I could never visualize the agles and stuff. This makes it all a lot easier to see what people mean when talking about the angles and what not. Also your info on the reset and travel distance is very thorough. Its nice to see how much of a difference a modification makes and be able to measure it accurately.

#13 Rob D

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Posted 06 November 2008 - 11:51 AM

This is a little off topic and a total rookie question, but when you say you stoned the trigger bar nose true, what kind of stone did you use and where can I find one? I keep seeing references to "stoning" trigger parts, and I assume it's some kind of grinding stone, but could somebody give me a little more information about what I need? Thanks in advance.
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#14 WARDOG

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Posted 07 November 2008 - 04:12 AM

Actually I used arkansas gunsmith stones (you can find'em easily at brownell's), but I suggest to use a flat small file with sandpaper of various grit, I can obtain a far smoother surface this way.

Hope it helps.

Thanks for viewing.

#15 MARKAVELI

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 09:33 AM

Great walk through...
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