[ButchW]

First off, I don't compete, never will. I don't like shooting 45 ACP and I have shot some of the best 1911's ever made.

What I am after is a target pistol in 9mm to kill paper for personal enjoyment and relaxation. I have a Beretta 92 with a trigger job of about 1.25 lbs. of slop and 3 pounds after that to pull the trigger.

I want better!!!! (My revolvers are in the less that 2 lb. range and crisp.)

I have seen many people shoot Brownings or clones in competitions.

Disabling the mag. safety cuts about 3lbs off a Browning. (And yes, some will have a problem with that, don't care, I always check my gun twice before pulling the trigger.)

Has anyone out there cut down the rest of the trigger assemble? What was your final result?

If I can't get a lot better than what I have in my Beretta, why spend money?

Thanks

This post has been edited by ButchW: 15 December 2007 - 11:17 PM

[shadetree]

Try a single action cz sub 2 is doable.

[North]

or 9mm 1911/2011, Springfield, STI, etc. plenty of good options.
Folks have made glocks, xds with amazing triggers as well.
Unless you just want a High Power,
I'm sure a good smith could get you a trigger you would be happy with on a High Power.

[North]

Cylinder and Slide has drop in kits for brownings and berretas. It may get you want you want with the mag disconect deactivated.

https://shop.cylinde...atstr=HOME:6:20

[et45]

FWIW On the last Browning HP I had taking out the mag safety did not help the trigger one bit.

[RePete]

ButchW, on Dec 16 2007, 01:15 AM, said:

First off, I don't compete, never will. I don't like shooting 45 ACP and I have shot some of the best 1911's ever made.

What I am after is a target pistol in 9mm to kill paper for personal enjoyment and relaxation. I have a Beretta 92 with a trigger job of about 1.25 lbs. of slop and 3 pounds after that to pull the trigger.

I want better!!!! (My revolvers are in the less that 2 lb. range and crisp.)

I have seen many people shoot Brownings or clones in competitions.

Disabling the mag. safety cuts about 3lbs off a Browning. (And yes, some will have a problem with that, don't care, I always check my gun twice before pulling the trigger.)

Has anyone out there cut down the rest of the trigger assemble? What was your final result?

If I can't get a lot better than what I have in my Beretta, why spend money?

Thanks

I changed the hammer spring to a 26lb'er, along with the mag safety removal. It helps.

[rubberneck]

I have owned two custom Hi-Powers in my life. One was built by Novak and the other by Don Williams at the Action Works. The trigger system on the Hi-Power makes it all but impossible to have a safe sub 3 pound trigger pull. All the top smiths generally won't go below 4 pounds. When done properly a trigger on a Hi-Power is nice and quite serviceable but you will never get one of those jaw dropping, "oh my god" that is fantastic trigger pulls. The single action CZ 75 can with an EGW hard sear.

[Patrick Sweeney]

You want a good BHP trigger pull, send it to:

Wayne Novak
Bill Laughridge
Ted Yost

Of the three, using the parts in the gun the Yost I have came out a bit better. If you have to have the best possible, get Bill to do the job with new parts, his hammer and sear. Tell them it is a competition gun, not a carry gun.

It will never be as good as the best 1911 (or some other models) trigger job, but that matters only if you're looking only for the 1.5 pound trigger pull. If three pounds and clean is good enough (and it should be, for all but GMs) those three guys can get you there.

[MichiganShootist]

Patrick has the right short list of BHP guys... I have one that I love which was worked on by one of the people on Patrick's list.... and with all due respect it's still not quite as good as a bad 1911. It's the way the trigger assembly is designed. They can get you a 3# trigger... but they really can't shorten the pull. I love mine... but that's because I shoot a lot of revolver and the pull is like a very much like a competition grade d/a revolver.

The thread starter said that 45 ACP was out.... then I suggest a 1911 in 9 mm. Then you get all the advantages of the 1911 trigger etc. At least 5 companies make them.... and tons of smiths work on them (if required).

One of the last guns in my safe that I'd part with is a nearly bone stock 9 mm Springfield 1911. It is scary accurate and very easy to shoot.

This post has been edited by MichiganShootist: 16 December 2007 - 03:17 PM

[RePete]

Yost has a way of shortening the pull - proprietry - don't ask, I already did, but not a problem.

[rubberneck]

When Novak worked on my Hi-Power Wayne never saw it. All the work was done by Kevin Stump. If I were to build another Hi-Power the list would have three names on it. Ted Yost, Don Williams and Jim Garthwaite.

This post has been edited by rubberneck: 16 December 2007 - 04:29 PM

[ButchW]

North, on Dec 16 2007, 05:35 AM, said:

Cylinder and Slide has drop in kits for brownings and berretas. It may get you want you want with the mag disconect deactivated.

https://shop.cylinde...atstr=HOME:6:20

Thanks. I will pass this along to my gunsmith to check out.

[ButchW]

Patrick Sweeney, on Dec 16 2007, 01:20 PM, said:

You want a good BHP trigger pull, send it to:

Wayne Novak
Bill Laughridge
Ted Yost

Of the three, using the parts in the gun the Yost I have came out a bit better. If you have to have the best possible, get Bill to do the job with new parts, his hammer and sear. Tell them it is a competition gun, not a carry gun.

It will never be as good as the best 1911 (or some other models) trigger job, but that matters only if you're looking only for the 1.5 pound trigger pull. If three pounds and clean is good enough (and it should be, for all but GMs) those three guys can get you there.

I already have basically 3lbs in my Beretta. I need much lower. My 686 had a 3.3 lb trigger nice and crisp and I did many 2" patterns. After a drop to 1.5lb lots of 1" patterns.

[ButchW]

Patrick Sweeney, on Dec 16 2007, 01:20 PM, said:

You want a good BHP trigger pull, send it to:

Wayne Novak

At the advise of a gunsmith I contacted Novak's originally and instantly pitched him. They said 4lbs. or so. (As in Parkersburg WV. unless there are two of them?)

[ButchW]

I have 2 separate gunsmith who told me flat out don't ever thing about 9mm in 1911 unless I want an ammo grinder. My father's 1911 could not do 9mm or 40 corbon or 10 mm, problem after problem but it could shoot 40 & 45 all day long. (His gun by today's standard is in the $3000 custom range.)

It looks like forget the Browning or clone from all that you all have said.

[JimmyZip]

North, on Dec 16 2007, 04:35 AM, said:

Cylinder and Slide has drop in kits for brownings and berretas. It may get you want you want with the mag disconect deactivated.

https://shop.cylinde...atstr=HOME:6:20

et45, on Dec 16 2007, 07:33 AM, said:

FWIW On the last Browning HP I had taking out the mag safety did not help the trigger one bit.

The guy my pop had do my HiPower did the drop in thing on mine. I think its around 4 lbs. I take out the magazine safety so that I can drop the hammer when I clear at the end of a stage. Otherwise, if you drop your mag, your clear and show empty, then you cannot drop the hammer unless you put in another mag. I do not find that much difference though on the trigger pull with it in. My .02

[pjb45]

Listen to Pat.
Cylinder and Slide can do an awesome trigger job. The key is the hammer
You can get a very sweet job out of Ralph there. BTW: if you look at the Pistolsmith Guild you will see two members of C&S--Bill and Ralph.
Additionally, C&S has a wider trigger you can get which will make it seem like the trigger is lighter.

If you are going to punch paper, remember BHP typically have a flyer. This can be reduced significantly. My BHP has a BarSto that was fitted by Irv when Bill took my gun out to him. No Fliers!

[Bill Nesbitt]

I have a Hi-Power done by Cylinder and Slide back around 1990. I think the pull is around 4# but feels a little lighter. The worst part is the sloppy reset. You can't feel it like on a 1911 or Glock.

I think there are probably a lot of guns that you could get a better trigger on than a Hi-Power.

[Flexmoney]

What are we after here?

Does it have to be the BHP?
Does it have to be 9mm?
Is it about money, at all?
Is it about accuracy?


Not much is more fun than shooting a nice .22 rimfire. They are as accurate as the day is long. And, you can shoot 3x as much (or more) for the cost of ammo...and never have to reload a round.

There are 9mm 1911's that run.

As Bill mentioned, you can get a Glock (or M&P) with a great trigger. (Maybe not as good as a 1911, likely better than a BHP).

Tangfolio and CZ have single action offering. S&W has some Performance Center guns that might work for you.

[Gary1911A1]

I must have a terrible M&P. I have three Hi-Powers. Two Brownings and a FN and I'ld rather shoot any of them than my M&P.

[Paradiddle]

I have an old HP - 1969. It has the mag disconnect fiasco removed. Not sure if anything else has been done to it, but I will say it has a fantastic trigger. Very smooth and crip and predictable. The HP fits my hand better then most any pistol or revolver I've tried - they are a pure joy to shoot.

Just my .02

Jeff

[mike cyrwus]

Gary1911A1, on Dec 17 2007, 01:46 PM, said:

I must have a terrible M&P. I have three Hi-Powers. Two Brownings and a FN and I'ld rather shoot any of them than my M&P.

Get a trigger job on it...

[ButchW]

I just bought a S&W Model 52. Yet to get it here or play with one.

I would like to stay 9mm. I have 10,000 brass, 10,000 bullets, all the Dillon stuff. Every powder worth owning for 9mm. 40k small pistol primers.

45 just doesn't do anything for me and I have shot some of the best.

I have no way to rent a gun in 40 S&W in my area to see if that is an option or not. But I am talking $500 to get another caliber by the time it is over and done. Unless I load 38 +P, I have nothing to give a general idea of 40 and then not in semi-auto. I don't load +P anyway. I like target wadcutters or 13.8 grains 2400 JHP .357. One is relaxing, one if flame throwing fun.

For everyone who said they have a good 9mm 1911. I have heard 10 horror stories. 2 gunsmiths told me don't!! Which by the way actually cost them money to say that. 1911 also will not do the other calibers I know I would like well either 357 sig 10mm or 40 corbon.

So far these are all the possible models to consider once the 1911 is out of the picture.

Browning HP or clone (looking slim) $200-$700
CZ 75 TS $1050
S&W 952 $1500 but I would have to have long slide $1700
EAA Gold $500
EAA Match $1600 (I might have these backwards on price.)

Anyone have other considerations?
Make & Model with a single action only trigger?
Do any of the above have direct connect mechanism like the 1911's or a revolver?

P226 X5 is out! It is just a double action trigger with no cocking. I could not believe the slop.

(Something I heard of which sounded really good was a 1911 that used 38/45?? a wildcat cartridge. Necked down 45ACP with 38 SWC lead bullets. But I have never seen one and don't know if anybody could build one or not from existing hardware.)


Thanks everyone.

[Patrick Sweeney]

Not to be snarky, but if the gunsmiths you're going to say the 1911 in 9mm is an impossible fit, you should be looking for new gunsmiths.

If you're going to compare, compare apples to apples, not oranges. A $500 BHP, compared to anything that costs $1200 or more, is going to look bad.

Now, a $500 BHP, with $700 of custom work done to it, will fare much better in comparison.

[Canuck-IL]

Quote

I have 2 separate gunsmith who told me flat out don't ever thing about 9mm in 1911 unless I want an ammo grinder

I've no idea what is meant by an "ammo grinder" but, whether it cost them money or not, that kind of generic statement is just plain stupid. Some strongly held biases are based on limited experience and a stubborn resistance to being convinced by mere facts and copious evidence.
/Bryan