[JThompson]

I had a great workout tonight. My draw was kickn and I was shooting As like never before. That A zone seemed to be twice the size it is. I was working the draw and two shots on one target and out of 50 draws I only missed two with Cs The draw and two shoots wasn't blazing, but around 1.15-1.45. That's fast for me shooting almost all As. Also grabbed a couple of the trasition and splits... I said I could pull off .08, but the best I saw tonight was .09s. There were maybe 8 of them tonight. Here is a pic of the 2 trans and splits.



I need to work on those transitions....

[Flexmoney]

Cool. What did you see ?

[JThompson]

Flexmoney, on May 26 2007, 12:18 AM, said:

Cool. What did you see ?

What I saw was the first shot where I wanted it and the second I just had a hint a red line as it came down from recoil. Those were both As by the way. I was at 15yds. (EDIT: 12-13 YDS I had moved up) I hope I don't lose it between tonight and practice tomorrow. I'm been on the range at least 4-5 hoursa day for the past two weeks... since I got the open back from HC. I've sent about 5k downrange in 2 weeks.

This post has been edited by JThompson: 26 May 2007 - 06:56 AM

[Pharaoh Bender]

JThompson, on May 26 2007, 01:27 AM, said:

I'm been on the range at least 4-5 hoursa day for the past two weeks... since I got the open back from HC. I've sent about 5k downrange in 2 weeks.

So what else do you do in heaven?

Congrats on the progress!

[JThompson]

Pharaoh Bender, on May 26 2007, 01:23 AM, said:

JThompson, on May 26 2007, 01:27 AM, said:

I'm been on the range at least 4-5 hoursa day for the past two weeks... since I got the open back from HC. I've sent about 5k downrange in 2 weeks.

So what else do you do in heaven?

Congrats on the progress!

Heaven, where the ammo is free As are abundent and us old guys have an unlimited supply of BenGay for those old muscles.

The progress... I'll accept the congrats when I can duplicate it. If I can keep my head out of it I might be able to swing it. I'll keep you guys posted. I have to give props to the forum... If I'm not working, or shooting I'm here reading. I've even been to the achives to gleen what I could from all the stuff in your pasts. Thanks to all who have taken the time to explain shooting and your thoughts. There's no other way I could have strapped on a holster a month ago and got to this point without this resource.

This post has been edited by JThompson: 25 May 2007 - 11:42 PM

[HSMITH]

DAYYUM, I shot a .16 split in a match on a 3 or 4 yard target last weekend and though that was pretty sporting. Here you are banging out .09's!!! When you get those transitions down I would like to see a video. On a normal day I can count on .21-.22 splits, you guys that can cut that in half amaze me. My saving grace is my transitions are pretty close to my splits.

Keep up the hard work!!

[JThompson]

HSMITH, on May 26 2007, 07:44 AM, said:

DAYYUM, I shot a .16 split in a match on a 3 or 4 yard target last weekend and though that was pretty sporting. Here you are banging out .09's!!! When you get those transitions down I would like to see a video. On a normal day I can count on .21-.22 splits, you guys that can cut that in half amaze me. My saving grace is my transitions are pretty close to my splits.

Keep up the hard work!!

Thanks Howard. A friend has a vid cam he doesn't use and said I was welcome to it.

I think I may know why the finger is fast, but I want to do some research with another new shooter I know. I've worked up some drills for her and if she shows improvement I will share it with the forum. I don't want to waste your time if it doesn't help her.

If I could get my transitions equal to yours and keep As on those splits I would be ecstatic! I think my eyes are following the gun instead of the other way round. There's just to much to work on all at once. Today I will attempt to pickup where I left off last night. If I can get back in that zone I will attempt to bring my awareness up while maintaining the focus. If I succeed in that I will attempt to change the way I see the next target, consciously moving my eyes and having the gun follow.

JT

[HSMITH]

JT, I don't know where you are but if you are in the MI, IN, OH area you might want to see about taking a lesson from Jake DiVita or Matt Cheely. Both of those guys are wicked fast on the transitions AND accurate. I am quite sure they will work your butt off in the lesson but I think you will make a really worthwhile improvement, and probably save a couple thousand rounds of ammo in the process of getting your transitions down. Jake is the one that finally put something down that made sense to my brain on how to learn the transitions. It made a tremendous difference in my shooting.

PS, don't tell anyone but training with great shooters is THE short path to shooting better, almost like cheating to learn the right way to do things instead of fighting through it.

[JThompson]

HSMITH, on May 26 2007, 08:59 AM, said:

JT, I don't know where you are but if you are in the MI, IN, OH area you might want to see about taking a lesson from Jake DiVita or Matt Cheely. Both of those guys are wicked fast on the transitions AND accurate. I am quite sure they will work your butt off in the lesson but I think you will make a really worthwhile improvement, and probably save a couple thousand rounds of ammo in the process of getting your transitions down. Jake is the one that finally put something down that made sense to my brain on how to learn the transitions. It made a tremendous difference in my shooting.

PS, don't tell anyone but training with great shooters is THE short path to shooting better, almost like cheating to learn the right way to do things instead of fighting through it.

This is probably the wrong approach, but for now I'm going to read all I can and do things that I find work for me. This may cost me hours of training out some bad habits later, but that's my nature. I do appreciate the people that take time to help and heed advice where I am comfortable with it. I don't think there is any "ONE" way to get the job done, so I intend to try all the ways that I find here and any that come to mind. I will select the ones that I'm comfortable with and go from there. At some point Matt and I are going to get together.. I'm an M/GM class photog, so we are probably going to swap some time out.

Thanks again for being willing to chime in... I would like to see more of the girls/guys put there thoughts down as well.

JT

This post has been edited by JThompson: 27 May 2007 - 01:54 AM

[wide45]

Great splits.




How far apart are the targets?

I know it's more fun to do things you are good at, but work harder on the transitions. They are much more important.

[JThompson]

wide45, on May 26 2007, 05:13 PM, said:

Great splits.




How far apart are the targets?

I know it's more fun to do things you are good at, but work harder on the transitions. They are much more important.

The were about 3 feet apart...

"Splits" I'm working on it rich.

[driver8M3]

i suggest practicing with 1 shot on each target instead.

[JThompson]

driver8M3, on May 27 2007, 08:14 AM, said:

i suggest practicing with 1 shot on each target instead.

I do that when working on the draw... I'm wondering how that improves splits? What's you thought behind it?

Thanks

JT

[driver8M3]

if your splits are anywhere near .09 you can move on to something else! 1 per target is for your transitions.

[JThompson]

driver8M3, on May 27 2007, 09:35 AM, said:

if your splits are anywhere near .09 you can move on to something else! 1 per target is for your transitions.

Okay, so you mean to save ammo and increase the number of times changing targets per amount of practice time.

Gotcha.

Thanks
JT

PS average splits are arounf .12=.15 and increase with distance to are max range of 25yrds. At that range, to shoot As, I'm from about .2-.4 depending of sight picture. I still see some aborations in recoil that cause me to make small adjustments when I'm shooting from farther away. This doesn't happen all the time, but is probably related to grip pressure of weak hand. I'm working that too.

This post has been edited by JThompson: 27 May 2007 - 08:43 AM

[XRe]

JThompson, on May 27 2007, 10:30 AM, said:

I do that when working on the draw... I'm wondering how that improves splits? What's you thought behind it?

They won't improve your splits. Your transitions are a weak spot - and that's what the one shot drills are intended to address. Its pure index. Steel Challenge stuff is the same way - no splits, pure draw and transitions. Your last sentence in the first post is all you need to know You're losing a half second on every transition right now...

[JThompson]

XRe, on May 27 2007, 09:40 AM, said:

JThompson, on May 27 2007, 10:30 AM, said:

I do that when working on the draw... I'm wondering how that improves splits? What's you thought behind it?

They won't improve your splits. Your transitions are a weak spot - and that's what the one shot drills are intended to address. Its pure index. Steel Challenge stuff is the same way - no splits, pure draw and transitions. Your last sentence in the first post is all you need to know You're losing a half second on every transition right now...

Thanks guys... I'm going to work those today. I decided to give me arms and bad wrist the day off yesterday. Okay, MaLady had a list of stuff to do and I was too damn tired when done.


JT

This post has been edited by JThompson: 27 May 2007 - 08:49 AM

[HSMITH]

JT, set up a bill drill with a par time that fits your normal (not rushed) draw and .25 splits. Dry fire it to get it down, use ALL of the time. Shoot that a couple times and get the cadence down where you use ALL of the time to do it in live fire. Now do the EXACT same cadence across three targets with the EXACT same splits. Start close, 5-7 yards with about two feet between targets. BE CAREFUL, learning to shoot a cadence is NOT what you want to do, you want to see what happens when you push the transitions down to .25's. THE most important part of this is to see what you see transitioning at that speed AND see what you don't see when compared to shooting the transitions you are capable of right now with certain A hits.

As this starts to work out move the targets further out and further apart. This is a training tool, be sure to do enough real precision stuff to keep from burning in shooting at any specific cadence. This works great to force you to transition, but can be REALLY damaging if you teach yourself to shoot a cadence on everything.

[JThompson]

HSMITH, on May 27 2007, 03:34 PM, said:

JT, set up a bill drill with a par time that fits your normal (not rushed) draw and .25 splits. Dry fire it to get it down, use ALL of the time. Shoot that a couple times and get the cadence down where you use ALL of the time to do it in live fire. Now do the EXACT same cadence across three targets with the EXACT same splits. Start close, 5-7 yards with about two feet between targets. BE CAREFUL, learning to shoot a cadence is NOT what you want to do, you want to see what happens when you push the transitions down to .25's. THE most important part of this is to see what you see transitioning at that speed AND see what you don't see when compared to shooting the transitions you are capable of right now with certain A hits.

As this starts to work out move the targets further out and further apart. This is a training tool, be sure to do enough real precision stuff to keep from burning in shooting at any specific cadence. This works great to force you to transition, but can be REALLY damaging if you teach yourself to shoot a cadence on everything.

Well we had a public shoot today and I showed up to help with safety... They had the front door open which crates a massive vacuum on the range door. My hand slipped off the hadle and I got my thumb slammed in the door. I had to quickly move to the med kit and throw some sterile bandages on it. I was the only safety officer as the other two were taking lunch. I didn't want to make everyone stop shooting, so I just delt with it.

I'll be working on my weak hand for the next couple of weeks...

Here's why:

This post has been edited by JThompson: 27 May 2007 - 04:59 PM

[Singlestack]

OUCH!!

You are gonna loose that thumbnail. I lost the nail on my left thumb last year after it decided to get closed in my car door while I was talking on the cell phone.

[JThompson]

Singlestack, on May 27 2007, 07:09 PM, said:

OUCH!!

You are gonna loose that thumbnail. I lost the nail on my left thumb last year after it decided to get closed in my car door while I was talking on the cell phone.

Yes, the nail is a gone... The bone isn't sore, so that's good and I think the split in the nail is a good thing as it released the pressure that would have made it throb. It's just sore and not beating to my pulse, so that's good. My weak hand was terrible anyway, so I'm looking at it as a blessing. I really don't like working the weak side and I need it.... I worked it for 3 hrs after the range closed to the public. I should have it whipped into shape in a couple weeks. The last guy on the range wanted to see some IPSC style stuff, so I took him to the holster range and let him shoot my STI. I think he's going to join soon and buy a dot. LOL He liked the dot.

Damned cell phones cause more problems....

This post has been edited by JThompson: 27 May 2007 - 05:24 PM

[XRe]

All I can say is.... OUCH!!! Damn, man... You'll be shooting fine pretty soon, though - that's not likely to slow you down for more than a few days, I'd imagine

[JThompson]

XRe, on May 27 2007, 07:44 PM, said:

All I can say is.... OUCH!!! Damn, man... You'll be shooting fine pretty soon, though - that's not likely to slow you down for more than a few days, I'd imagine

I was still working the draw and shift to weak hand. Loading mags is an issue though. It's kind of funny when you think about it... safety officer smashes thumb and bleeds all over range. hahahh

This post has been edited by JThompson: 27 May 2007 - 05:57 PM

[XRe]

Maybe you didn't know this man - sorry we assumed. When we talk about "splits", we're talking about shot to shot times... not what we do to our fingers...

Yeah, it would have to be when you're the "safety" officer... Kind of like the shop teacher who's missing 3 or 4 fingers (ala Tim Allen's standup routines...)

[JThompson]

XRe, on May 27 2007, 08:19 PM, said:

Maybe you didn't know this man - sorry we assumed. When we talk about "splits", we're talking about shot to shot times... not what we do to our fingers...



Yeah, it would have to be when you're the "safety" officer... Kind of like the shop teacher who's missing 3 or 4 fingers (ala Tim Allen's standup routines...)

Payback's buddy.... I'll remember.

That's what I was thinking sitting here... shop teacher. Was every shop teacher missing a digit? I know ours was.

This post has been edited by JThompson: 27 May 2007 - 06:26 PM