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Recoil Springs For G17 And G22


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#1 bigb77803

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Posted 02 May 2007 - 07:31 AM

I have 2 questions. Can anyone tell me what the stock spring pound is for both guns and my second question is what is the lightest spring I can replace them with?

#2 glock_556

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Posted 02 May 2007 - 07:37 AM

I believe that the stock springs are 17lbs. As far as the lightest you can go, I think that would depend on what ammo you are using.

I tried a 13lb in my G34 using WWB but it wouldn't allow my gun to fully return to battery. I currently use a 15lb spring and to be honest, can't tell a whole lot of difference between that and the factory 17lb spring for my particular application, YMMV.

#3 Joe D

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Posted 02 May 2007 - 07:55 AM

I run a 12# spring in my competition guns - major and minor.

#4 Aircooled6racer

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Posted 02 May 2007 - 09:30 AM

Hello: Listen to Joe he knows his stuff. He told me to try a 13 pound spring first and it works fine in my 22 with minor loads. The loads were too minor after I chronoed them ;-) Thanks, Eric

#5 Flexmoney

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Posted 02 May 2007 - 09:40 AM

bigb77803,

Why do you want to go with a lighter spring? Are you having any issues?
Thank you,

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#6 bigb77803

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Posted 02 May 2007 - 06:10 PM

bigb77803,

Why do you want to go with a lighter spring? Are you having any issues?



No, I'm not having any issues. I was wanting to expierment with a lighter spring to see if it would help with action and cycling. It there is no benifit to changing I will leave it with the stock spring. The spring and barrell are the only parts that I have not replaced. I shoot the gun competition at a local group and in Houston.

#7 itchy

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Posted 02 May 2007 - 07:06 PM

I think the poundage you want to use would be determined by what type of shooting you plan to do.

I have a 12# spring in my G17 when shooting steel loads (so minor that it's almost embarrassing). But sometimes I feel like I'm on the brink of disaster. It becomes that balance between light enough to extract vs. strong enough to get back into battery. Or, don't let any part of the slide rub anything on the way back. :lol:

When I shoot real minor loads :lol: for production, I usually have a 15# or a really worn factory glock spring (so beat up it couldn't be 17# any more)

I think factory G17 is 17#, how convenient.

Good luck,

Itchy

#8 Duane Thomas

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Posted 02 May 2007 - 09:06 PM

It's important when going with any lighter-than-stock recoil spring in a Glock to also go to a lighter "competition" striker spring, otherwise you can get into a situation where the gun may fire out of battery. The lighter striker spring keeps things balanced out.

As to recoil spring weight, I've gone down to 11 pounds in a Glock 34 and the gun worked but the recoil impulse was fairly violent. I shot around 20K with an ISMI 13-pounder and the gun always worked fine. Frankly, lately I've been going up in poundage on my recoil springs to get the guns to cycle faster. I've found that how the gun tracks in recoil is more important to me that having "soft" recoil which is why we go to a lighter recoil spring to start with. In my G34 I'm actually running a stock equivalent 17-pounder (also from ISMI). In the G17 I do prefer a 15-pounder over the stock 17. YMMV.
Pride and fear are emotions, which hope for an outcome. Outcomes take your attention from the present, where the shooting happens, to the future. It is totally impossible to do anything in the future, because it hasn't happened yet. The key to shooting your best is to be present as the witness of the shooting. Do not judge, do not give yourself anything to live up to. We can only shoot as well as we have trained ourselves to shoot. To try to shoot only induces stress. Be content with your current ability. And accumulate practice to improve that ability. Consolidate, build strength where you feel weakness. We cannot raise our ability until we accept our current limitations. Practice dissolves limitations. Matches simply define where the current limits exist. The game of shooting is all about redefining our limits.
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#9 kamann

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 10:41 PM

It's important when going with any lighter-than-stock recoil spring in a Glock to also go to a lighter "competition" striker spring, otherwise you can get into a situation where the gun may fire out of battery. The lighter striker spring keeps things balanced out.

As to recoil spring weight, I've gone down to 11 pounds in a Glock 34 and the gun worked but the recoil impulse was fairly violent. I shot around 20K with an ISMI 13-pounder and the gun always worked fine. Frankly, lately I've been going up in poundage on my recoil springs to get the guns to cycle faster. I've found that how the gun tracks in recoil is more important to me that having "soft" recoil which is why we go to a lighter recoil spring to start with. In my G34 I'm actually running a stock equivalent 17-pounder (also from ISMI). In the G17 I do prefer a 15-pounder over the stock 17. YMMV.


Whats your current loads if you don't mind? I'm thinking about upping my loads to 140 PF and using the 17lb springs in my 34 and 17. I shot some WWB again recently and relized how much faster my front sight was getting back on target and it made me think.

#10 Duane Thomas

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Posted 09 May 2007 - 01:57 PM

These days my practice and match load is actually factory "blue box" Black Hills 124-gr. FMJ.
Pride and fear are emotions, which hope for an outcome. Outcomes take your attention from the present, where the shooting happens, to the future. It is totally impossible to do anything in the future, because it hasn't happened yet. The key to shooting your best is to be present as the witness of the shooting. Do not judge, do not give yourself anything to live up to. We can only shoot as well as we have trained ourselves to shoot. To try to shoot only induces stress. Be content with your current ability. And accumulate practice to improve that ability. Consolidate, build strength where you feel weakness. We cannot raise our ability until we accept our current limitations. Practice dissolves limitations. Matches simply define where the current limits exist. The game of shooting is all about redefining our limits.
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#11 racerba

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Posted 09 May 2007 - 02:08 PM

YMMV.

What does YMMV mean?!?!
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#12 mikey357

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Posted 09 May 2007 - 03:06 PM

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#13 Hany

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Posted 16 May 2007 - 05:29 PM

I now run a wolf 15lb, w/ a steel guiderod. It works fine with all factory loads which includes 127g+p+ duty loads. I ran a factory spring for about 40k in my first 17, it still functioned fine when I finally replaced it even though it was much lighter than 17lb by then.

#14 Kevin Kline

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Posted 16 May 2007 - 07:16 PM

I normally run a 12lb Wolff and Wolff steel rod in my G34 w/ Prod loads. I sometimes put a 14lb Wolff in and there really isn't much difference, very slight.

In my G35 Lim gun w/ Lim loads, I run a 15lb Wolff.

#15 cmu7999321

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 08:15 AM

Do you guys using ISMI springs trim them at all?

How can you tell if the recoil spring needs to be trimmed?

I have a G34 with light loads and I am expermenting with a tungsten recoil rod and different recoil springs but I am not sure when/if to trim the spring.

Thanks!
Corey

Edited by cmu7999321, 18 May 2007 - 08:16 AM.


#16 Joe D

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 09:18 AM

When I used the ISMI 13# I would trim 2-3 coils off.

#17 cmu7999321

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 11:30 AM

JoeD, what make you decide to clip 2 or 3 coils off?

#18 Duane Thomas

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 04:26 PM

I don't clip coils at all.
Pride and fear are emotions, which hope for an outcome. Outcomes take your attention from the present, where the shooting happens, to the future. It is totally impossible to do anything in the future, because it hasn't happened yet. The key to shooting your best is to be present as the witness of the shooting. Do not judge, do not give yourself anything to live up to. We can only shoot as well as we have trained ourselves to shoot. To try to shoot only induces stress. Be content with your current ability. And accumulate practice to improve that ability. Consolidate, build strength where you feel weakness. We cannot raise our ability until we accept our current limitations. Practice dissolves limitations. Matches simply define where the current limits exist. The game of shooting is all about redefining our limits.
- Sam

Amateurs do it til they get it right. Professionals do it til they can't get it wrong.

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"The only reason why Everest is the highest mountain ever climbed is because it's the highest. If there was one higher, I bet there'd be people trying to climb it."
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#19 Exodus

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Posted 21 May 2007 - 06:00 PM

From www.custom-glock.com

Matt uses and recommends ISMI recoil springs for Glock pistols.

Recommend starting springs weights:

G17 13lb
G19 13lb
G20 15lb
G21 13lb
G22 15lb
G23 13-15lb
G24 13lb
G31 15lb
G32 13-15lb
G34 13lb
G35 15lb

Matt’s spring setups:

G34 Production 13lb minus 4 coils
G35 Limited 15lb minus 3 coils
G17 Open 13lb minus 5 coils
G19C Carry 13lb minus 6 coils

More spring info

www.custom-glock.com/springtech.html
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#20 SA Friday

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Posted 08 June 2007 - 10:12 AM

Do you guys using ISMI springs trim them at all?

How can you tell if the recoil spring needs to be trimmed?

I have a G34 with light loads and I am expermenting with a tungsten recoil rod and different recoil springs but I am not sure when/if to trim the spring.

Thanks!
Corey


cutting coils off doesn't necessarily change the spring weight. The weight usually stays pretty much the same. What cutting coils off does is change the length the spring is at full compression. So, if you cut coils off, your slide travels a little more and this affects your brass ejection. For example, I shoot a 130 pf reload (147gr zero HP over 2.9gr of TG) in my Glock 34. I was running an uncut 13lb ISMI recoil spring. With that light a load, I was getting very hot (TITEGROUP is very hot burning) brass dribbling out and down my hand. So, I started cutting coils off until I got a reliable (about 1 foot out from the gun) ejection of the brass. I stopped cutting at -3 coils.

Now for the no-crap-better read this part. You MUST absolutely positively have your firearm completely lock shut with whatever weight or length recoil spring you use. If it doesn't, you could actually have a round go off with the slide and barrel not fully locked shut. Bad ju-ju. Test this with any new recoil spring, and regularly with the one you are using. I function check this every cleaning. If there is any doubt, I change the recoil spring to a new one.

The easiest way to test this is dry fire the glock and hold the trigger back. Point the muzzle straignt up, and slowly pull the slide back to break the breach open. Then slowly let the action go forward until right about where the spring should slam the slide and barrel into a fully locked position and let go of the slide. You keep the trigger pulled back through-out the test. If the slide/barrel hangs up in the slightest when you let go, you don't have enough juice in the spring.

Here's what I have found to work in my guns (caveat: every gun is different, and a simple parts change can affect the gun to require a heavier or lighter spring. If in doubt, function check everything thoroughly)

G17 - 13lb ISMI
G34 - 13lb ISMI with 3 coils cut off (G34 slide is heavier than a G17's)
G35 - 13lb ISMI
G24 - 15lb ISMI (heavier slide by a long shot, and an aftermarket KKM barrel causes it to be tighter)


If in doubt, always error to the heavier recoil spring. If going lighter than 13 or 14 lb recoil spring, you must change the striker spring to a reduced weight striker spring. The two springs work against each other, and without the lighter striker spring, you cannot get the gun to reliably go back to the fully locked position.

If all of this is just too much, stay stock and shoot 138+pf (about where WWB come out at). The more I shoot, the less I think a super light reload is truely needed. My production reloads have recently seen an increase in powder for more reliable steel hits, and I haven't seen any decrease in my shooting times.

hope this helps.
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#21 Glockster35

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Posted 10 June 2007 - 11:32 AM

Interesting, I see people are using both Wolff and ISMI springs and doing multiple changes to them to get the most out of their firearms.

Thanks for sharing information, and more importantly pin pointing why and how to test for proper fitting!
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#22 Radical Precision Designs

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Posted 10 June 2007 - 08:43 PM

Lately I have been dabbling quite a bit with OPEN Glock "technology". When you enter the "darkside" with a Glock ... all bets are off!!

I have seen a few compensated/open Glocks suffering a few malfunctions, mostly due to springs usage. Glocks require a much higher "residual" preload in the springs while at battery than 19/2011's. Many of the malfunctions I see are related to the use of "sub 11 lbs" springs. The lightest "flat spring" available specifically for Glocks is made by ISMI, (a 11 lb.), and it seems that only a few distributors/suppliers carry them in stock. This is prompting a few shooters who feel they have the need for lighter spring weights like 10 lbs. or 9 lbs to delve into using various springs (mostly Wolff) that were originally designed for 19/2011 use "only/mostly. Two BIG problems with this practice. First, the winding of coils for the gauge used is tighter, and this mandates that these springs at "full compression" using full length springs will need/occupy a larger area before reaching "binding status", which is a big no-no in any gun, be it Glock or 19/2011. So, second, in order to avoid this the springs are cut in length ... this brings about the biggest problem I have seen >>> the loss of residual/preload strenght so necessary in Glocks to achieve positive battery/lock-up. You see, 19/2011's do not require as much pre-load, and they do not need to allow for striker spring counter-effect.

Wouldn't it be nice if ISMI or Wolff would fabricate "made for Glock" flat springs in weights lower than 11 lbs?????

For use in Open Glocks, of course ... :cheers:
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#23 Duane Thomas

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Posted 11 June 2007 - 07:06 PM

Interesting, I see people are using both Wolff and ISMI springs and doing multiple changes to them to get the most out of their firearms.

Not necessarily. I run a stock equivalent 17-pound ISMI spring in my G34 with no changes whatsoever.
Pride and fear are emotions, which hope for an outcome. Outcomes take your attention from the present, where the shooting happens, to the future. It is totally impossible to do anything in the future, because it hasn't happened yet. The key to shooting your best is to be present as the witness of the shooting. Do not judge, do not give yourself anything to live up to. We can only shoot as well as we have trained ourselves to shoot. To try to shoot only induces stress. Be content with your current ability. And accumulate practice to improve that ability. Consolidate, build strength where you feel weakness. We cannot raise our ability until we accept our current limitations. Practice dissolves limitations. Matches simply define where the current limits exist. The game of shooting is all about redefining our limits.
- Sam

Amateurs do it til they get it right. Professionals do it til they can't get it wrong.

"It's not the will to win that matters - everyone has that. It's the will to prepare to win that matters."
- Paul "Bear" Bryant

"The only reason why Everest is the highest mountain ever climbed is because it's the highest. If there was one higher, I bet there'd be people trying to climb it."
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#24 open17

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Posted 11 June 2007 - 07:59 PM

The gun---G17 open. Lightened slide, KKM barrel, Ti comp, 3 blow holes, melted in Docter. All the usual bells and whistles. Running a 124 PD FMJ at 172ish.

I've played the spring game up and down. Finally ended up using a stock Glock 17 lb spring!
Gun functions fine clear down to a 13 lb ISMI with 3 coils cut, but with anything lighter than a 17
the dot indexes high when the gun returns to battery.

Bill
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#25 TKJ

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 05:45 AM

The gun---G17 open. Lightened slide, KKM barrel, Ti comp, 3 blow holes, melted in Docter. All the usual bells and whistles. Running a 124 PD FMJ at 172ish.

Bill


Hi Bill

how much does those 3 blow holes help to tame muzzle flip and dot movement? I was considering doing a few blow holes myself in diameter of 3 or 4mm, what size are yours.
Can you provide some pictures of your compensator and blow hole combination?




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