174 replies to this topic

[Art Yeo]

I have had this M&P9 FS since I re-started shooting some 3-4 years ago. When I first had it, I didn't know better and I thot it was a great gun until I started acquiring 1911's, Beretta 92A1 and, of course, revolvers.

Don't get me wrong, I love S&W and the M&P platform but the inaccuracy is driving me nuts.
At 25ft, I am getting 4-5" group vs 1-2" group from my Beretta ... and 0.5-1" group with overlapping holes from a S&W 627 revolver. No such issues with my M&P45.
Same story at 50ft, with groupings adjusted wider. In fact, if you were to look at the paper plate, the M&P grouping looks like a shot gun discharge.

All the ammo were hand loaded MG (115gr and 124gr) for the 9mm pistols and the 357mag was LSWC 158gr Hunter's Supply. I have previously used factory loads and they were similar.

I think this is the last straw and I'm about to ditch this M&P ... until I started reading about Storm Lake, KKM ... and the upcoming Apex/Bar-Sto 3rd-party barrels.
In your opinion and experiences, do you think the current Storm Lake or KKM barrels will make any significant difference in improving the accuracy of the M&P9 ?

I have sent in the gun to S&W and it was returned to me without anything done to it except firing 5 rounds of 115gr FMJ and claiming it was within factory specs.

Any thots?

Edited by Art Yeo, 22 August 2012 - 10:13 PM.

[tomaustin]

Funny, I've been having the same problem with my M&P Pro; I even used Storm Lake barrel and KKM, but the precision is still disappointing. At 35 yards, the best I can get is 8-10" group and even that isn't consistent. Even tried a half-dozen brands of ammunition, which created different size groups, but nothing better than 8-10 inches. At this point, I've realized that perhaps my shooting ability exceeds the capability of the gun, so it's time to look at something else. However, I'm only interested in production division shooting, so I'm considering switching to a CZ pistol from Matt Mink.

I am very interested in hearing feedback from elite "production division" shooters that are former M&P users. Did you find a solution to improve precision of your M&P Pro? If not, what did you switch to? And was the switch worthwhile?

[Seth]

I tried desperately to make an 9L work for production. I messed with bullet weight, bullet coating, powder, and even swapped the barrels, only to make no noticeable improvement in accuracy. From a rest at 25 yards the gun would NOT do better than 6-8".

I gave up. Its got a great grip, excellent trigger which can be easily improved upon, perfect reliability and the worst accuracy of any pistol I've ever touched.

[Art Yeo]

Any idea what's the root cause(s) of this inaccuracy: is it the re-seating of the barrel when it recycles since the 3rd party match barrels ruled out the inside of the barrel itself?

Like some of you, I like my Apex trigger action and the grip and even the looks of it.

[MarkCO]

The KKM with 147s vastly improved my accuracy on the 9Pro to about 3-4" at 25 yards.

I think it has to do with inconsistent lock-up of the stock barrel.

[Art Yeo]

Yes, it is.
Looks like there's a new barrel design that was released this year.
http://10-8performan...938663367879548

[Seth]

The new barrel made zero difference in mine. It tightened the lock up just a little but group size opened up even more. I bought that new barrel about 3 weeks ago.

[Art Yeo]

That's sad to know.

Interesting to note that they have slowed down the twist rate for the new barrel. Wouldn't that destablize the heavier bullets even more?

Edited by Art Yeo, 23 August 2012 - 09:30 AM.

[MarkCO]

That's sad to know.

Interesting to note that they have slowed down the twist rate for the new barrel. Wouldn't that destablize the heavier bullets even more?

Yes, it did. I had the new barrel in mine. 115s were marginal, 124s worse and 147s were worse than a buckshot pattern at 50 yards!

Interesting note. A department here in CO is now issuing M&Ps. I told one of their officers "get close before you shoot with that" kind of joking. He had not shot past 10 yards yet. He kind of looked worried. Called me up last week really upset after shooting at 25 yards.

[Art Yeo]

The KKM with 147s vastly improved my accuracy on the 9Pro to about 3-4" at 25 yards.

I think it has to do with inconsistent lock-up of the stock barrel.

At closer range, say, 25ft or less, were you able to do overlapping holes with some close by using the KKM barrel?

[Shadowrider]

I can't count the threads on all the forums on this issue and the recurring theme is that the .45s are fine. My 9 Pro isn't as accurate as I'd like but it's not that bad. My M&P45 is better so it fits the pattern. I'm wondering what's different between the two. Less frame flex from the larger framed .45?

[MarkCO]

The KKM with 147s vastly improved my accuracy on the 9Pro to about 3-4" at 25 yards.

I think it has to do with inconsistent lock-up of the stock barrel.

At closer range, say, 25ft or less, were you able to do overlapping holes with some close by using the KKM barrel?

At 25 feet, it was a 1" cluster of 5 rounds with some touching each other.

[MarkCO]

I can't count the threads on all the forums on this issue and the recurring theme is that the .45s are fine. My 9 Pro isn't as accurate as I'd like but it's not that bad. My M&P45 is better so it fits the pattern. I'm wondering what's different between the two. Less frame flex from the larger framed .45?

The 9Ls and 9Pro actually seem to be the problem children. The shorter 9mms and the .40s and .45s all seem to have no issues..

[Art Yeo]

At 25 feet, it was a 1" cluster of 5 rounds with some touching each other.

So, I am guessing the KKM barrel is worth it and is a possible fix for this issue ... and, it can possibly work on mine as well.
I was told by KKM that if it does not work, they will refund it in full.

Edited by Art Yeo, 23 August 2012 - 02:24 PM.

[Art Yeo]

The 9Ls and 9Pro actually seem to be the problem children. The shorter 9mms and the .40s and .45s all seem to have no issues..

Just for the records, mine is a regular 4.25" production gun, not the pro or L version.
At 25ft, I am getting a scatter gun effect which baffled me to no end. It appeared to me that the barrel is locking up in an ever slightly different position after every recycling of every shot.

[MarkCO]

At 25 feet, it was a 1" cluster of 5 rounds with some touching each other.

So, I am guessing the KKM barrel is worth it and is a possible fix for this issue ... and, it can possibly work on mine as well.
I was told by KKM that if it does not work, they will refund it in full.

Nothing to lose but postage

[soterik]

I have a Pro which I have been complaining about the accuracy. Dropped in a KKM barrel and that helped some.
I use only factory ammo and have found the brand and weight makes a big difference. Mine likes American Eagle 147.

Just got a CZ and the accuracy is night and day.

[Art Yeo]

Thanks for the input about the KKM barrel.

As of now, I can tell you that I have the same feeling when shooting the Beretta 92A1 and the M&P9: accuracy was also day and night, respectively. I have come to a point where if the KKM barrel does not work, I'm going to get myself another 92A1 as a backup for IDPA. I have confidence on the 92A1; particularly, for targets further than 50ft.

[soterik]

But there are many other factors to consider. The most accurate gun isn't necessarily the best overall.

At my last match I shot my most accurate match I have ever shot. With my M&P ! But there were no targets more than 20 yds away.
Prior to that match I was ready to dump the M&P. Not any more !

[Shadowrider]

I can't count the threads on all the forums on this issue and the recurring theme is that the .45s are fine. My 9 Pro isn't as accurate as I'd like but it's not that bad. My M&P45 is better so it fits the pattern. I'm wondering what's different between the two. Less frame flex from the larger framed .45?

The 9Ls and 9Pro actually seem to be the problem children. The shorter 9mms and the .40s and .45s all seem to have no issues..

Hmm... That would seem like premature unlocking before the bullet has left the barrel or just as it is leaving. But it's really hard to believe they would have it that close, the barrel length just isn't that much different. I was told by a pretty good M&P smith that the very early barrels (Pro and L) are kind of iffy on tolerances. My money is that they still are.

[Art Yeo]

It appears that your M&P is gaining your favor at shorter range and that's good.

For mine, I feel like I have no control over the groups whether I am near or far.
At 25ft, all of my other handguns were shooting overlapping holes and the furthest groups were 1.5".
Like I have said earlier, I think the barrel of my M&P9 seats differently every time it completes its recycling. There's no grouping pattern that I can see.

[mcracco]

Pretty happy with Storm Lake barrels in both 9FS and 9Pro. Really don't know what they are shooting for groups. Shooting IDPA and I am able to call shots so that is all that is important right now. As someone else pointed out, the M&P is such a great handling match gun I'll accept that brand X might shoot a better benchrest group.

However, G&R Tactical will be custom fitting oversize Storm Lake barrels in Pro slides and I am itching to try one just because I like new stuff.

[SV-COP]

Man, y'all have me re-thinking a trade I was going to make with my G34. I will never shoot production enough to matter, but I do keep the 34 on my nightstand with a tac light on it.

It's funny though, a good friend of mine placed 6th at the World Speed Shooting Challenge with an M&P. I guess it was accurate "enough"....

[Seth]

I wouldn't trade a glock for an m&p. I hate the glock grip, I hate the trigger and can't stand the Koolaid drinkers. But at least it'll shoot in a strait line. I considered putting an aftermarket barrel in it, but it wasn't worth $180 for a cheap plastic gun.

The m&p just couldn't deliver enough accuracy to reliables call shots beyond 15 yards. Unacceptable to me.

I'll stick with limited.

[Ronnie j]

. The most accurate gun isn't necessarily the best overall. At my last match I shot my most accurate match I have ever shot. With my M&P ! But there were no targets more than 20 yds away. Prior to that match I was ready to dump the M&P. Not any more !

You don't truly believe that do you? A gun that doesn't hit where you point it has no purpose, other than to destroy your confidence .