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9mm Major Load Data


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#376 G-ManBart

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Posted 21 July 2010 - 07:54 AM

Notes: As you can see I only had one load that made Major PF and then just! I picked a COL of 1.170 to keep pressure down and it seemed to be a common / popular choice but I found that it was just a bit too long to fit in my STI mags with 9mm spacers.

From here I'll try the Ramshot Silhouette at shorter COL's (I've seen several references for this powder / bullet combo at shorter COL's) before I go to a higher charge weight, as I find 8gr is nearly a compressed load.

Overall, compared to results posted here I seemed to be getting ~2.5% - 3.0% lower velocites with the Silhouette and ~6% lower with Autocomp. At first I thought my chrono was mis-calibrated but due to different deltas from the reported data I don't think so. But I could be wrong.

Also, the previous pistol owner told me 8.0 gr of Silhouette gave him 170PF. I think he said COL was 1.170.

Any other thoughts?


Note the part I put in bold....it doesn't work that way. If you increase the OAL, it will lower the pressure and lower the velocity. That means you'll simply need more powder to increase the pressure and velocity to the desired level.

There just isn't a free lunch where you can increase the OAL and keep the same velocity, but get lower pressures. Set the OAL at what fits in your mags and what runs in the gun, then adjust the powder charge to get the velocity you want. In the end, shorter OAL, longer OAL, more powder, less powder, it's still going to take the same amount of pressure to drive the bullet to the target velocity.

People will often bring up different pressure curves when talking about varying OAL, and that can be true, but almost any change we make also changes the pressure curve, to some degree or another, but it's not going to make a significant change in peak pressure, which is what we're concerned with.

If you're using a different lot of powder (likely) than the original owner, and sometimes even a different lot of the same bullet, you're likely going to see a difference in velocity. On top of that, no two chronos are the same, and environmental conditions are rarely identical. Throw in the fact that many people do very limited chrono testing and call it good...i.e. they run five rounds over the chrono, got 170PF and they stick to that load for a long time without ever checking it again. Add all of those things up and there really isn't any way to tell if what you're seeing is different from what the original owner was getting. R,
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#377 lcs

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Posted 21 July 2010 - 08:22 AM

Let me start off by stating I'm new to Open guns and 9mm Major but otheriwse an experenced shooter and reloader.

So, here are my results...


COL: 1.170 - 1.175

Charge Min V Max V Avg V Spread Std Dev PF
Ramshot Silhouette
7.0 1196 1239 1217 43 11 152
7.2 1225 1260 1240 35 13 155
7.4 1247 1291 1266 44 13 158
7.6 1271 1294 1284 23 8 160
7.8 1284 1320 1298 36 13 162
8.0 1306 1347 1326 41 13 166


Notes: As you can see I only had one load that made Major PF and then just! I picked a COL of 1.170 to keep pressure down and it seemed to be a common / popular choice but I found that it was just a bit too long to fit in my STI mags with 9mm spacers.

From here I'll try the Ramshot Silhouette at shorter COL's (I've seen several references for this powder / bullet combo at shorter COL's) before I go to a higher charge weight, as I find 8gr is nearly a compressed load.

Overall, compared to results posted here I seemed to be getting ~2.5% - 3.0% lower velocites with the Silhouette and ~6% lower with Autocomp. At first I thought my chrono was mis-calibrated but due to different deltas from the reported data I don't think so. But I could be wrong.

Also, the previous pistol owner told me 8.0 gr of Silhouette gave him 170PF. I think he said COL was 1.170.

Any other thoughts?


I used a lot of Silhouette for 9Major and I use it for 38SC. First, Sil is temp sensitive. PF goes way up when it's 30 degrees or colder. Will drop from 170 to 165 when the heat and humidity is aroud 95. Different barrels exhibited this behavior.

Having said that, Sil is (IMO) a good powder for 9 Major. Do not shorten your OAL. 1.175 keeps the pressure down and should allow feeding in all mags. With a 125gr bullet you can easily reach 172-175PF in 9 Major. Depending on the comp---the gun should shoot flatter around 172-175.

Just remember if your load makes 172PF in 90 degree weather---PF goes up when the temp drops 20 degrees or so.

#378 Rob Tompkins

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Posted 21 July 2010 - 08:55 AM

Roger that G-ManBart. :cheers: With the general pressure concerns with 9mm Major, I'm just casting about for ideas before I redevelop loads at a new COL.

Of the loads presentenced in this thread, using that powder, I'd seen COL's of 1.16 and 1.17, both had given acceptable velocity / PF at nearly at nearly the same levels, so I picked 1.17 as the lesser of the two peak pressure evil’s. BTW, that length works ok in 2 of my 4 mags. I had only tested it in one mag prior to the range trip, imagine my surprise! :o

I guess the real question is, will a COL reduction of 0.01 or 0.015 inch make that much difference? A comfy PF margin of 170+ would call for 40 fps more AVG Vel.

I had initially thought (and it may truly be) effects of different powder lot's but there have been quite a few reports of that charge weight +/- 0.1 grain giving PF's of 170+ and they can't all be loading from the same lot. Most reported bullets were MG but I'm using Zero brand, so maybe there is a bullet brand effect? I've heard of that before.

Oh well, off to do more experiments! ;)

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#379 CocoBolo

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Posted 21 July 2010 - 09:00 AM

Having said that, Sil is (IMO) a good powder for 9 Major. Do not shorten your OAL. 1.175 keeps the pressure



FullRace/Rob/G-man - Sil is one of the better powders for 9 Major, fully agree. I've shot out to 1.190 using STI mag with metal spacer from shooters connection. I did have to form the spacer to the mag so that it set flat against the back of the mag at the top. I prefer the SV or SVI aka Infinity mags for 9 Major these do not require a spacer. They do have two bad traits 1. Expensive and 2. Fit. Its hit or miss on the mag fitting the gun and dropping free, I think the new design has even more issue, so find a good old one. Rubber hammer time or vise. I load my Zero 125gr JHP's at 1.160 an arbitrary length that works for my gun and mags. Sil at 7.8 gr bumps 166 avg 4.25" gun with Brazos Comp. Normally run 8.0gr @170pf.

I've tested N350, AutoComp, 3N37, HS6, AA#7 and Sil with 125gr. Sil won the tests. I'm going to start another round of testing with 115gr soon with just HS6 and Sil to see if I can get my shorty to behave as well as a full size gun shooting 125. TruBlue is anohter powder some shooters like, but its nasty stuff. Whats good in 38 Super is not necessarly good in 9 major it just don't work that way.

G-man nailed it, I find a good load and just keep cranking them out and shooting them. Before I go to a major match I will verify the load over the crono (I did 7 majors last year). That is when you find out it don't go fast like it use to, so you just adjust it and start cranking those out. Once it went the other way my 170pf load had turned into a monster 189pf load. So you should crono on some scheduled basis like once a quarter?

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#380 Rob Tompkins

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Posted 21 July 2010 - 09:00 AM

FullRace,

Ambiant temp was 90+ deg, shooting from a shaded position.

To keep a 1.17 COL I'll need to toss the 9mm spaces out and get new springs/followers. Not a big deal, just a pain in the a$$.

Thanks,

Rob

Edited by Rob Tompkins, 21 July 2010 - 09:00 AM.

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#381 snipermike

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Posted 22 July 2010 - 08:38 PM

Just kicking some ideas around on a 9mm major open pistol, I currently shooting a Glock 34 for production and also to practice with. I don't know too much about 9mm major ,but for my next project is to build a 9mm open in major class. I prefer Glock due to it's cost effectiveness. Don't get me wrong I highly appreciate all the STI's SVI's,and etc , but as far as the funds go I can get out there with a less expensive pistol "Glock". I'm pretty experience in loading but never loaded anything such as the 9mm major load. Any suggestions,advice,and experience know how's will be much appreciated.

#382 SLM

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Posted 22 July 2010 - 10:17 PM

To keep a 1.17 COL I'll need to toss the 9mm spaces out and get new springs/followers. Not a big deal, just a pain in the a$$.

Thanks,

Rob

Are you sure about that length? I use Montana Gold JHP's and can go out to 1.190" with STI mags and steel spacers without issue. Just asking as some progressive presses load "longer" when all stations are full verses one at a time.

And I've found that Silhouette does vary some lot to lot. I had one lot that went 173 PF with 8.4 grains and the next lot I got took 8.8 grains. My current lot takes 8.9 to get there.
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#383 Rob Tompkins

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Posted 23 July 2010 - 07:49 PM




To keep a 1.17 COL I'll need to toss the 9mm spaces out and get new springs/followers. Not a big deal, just a pain in the a$$.

Thanks,

Rob

Are you sure about that length? I use Montana Gold JHP's and can go out to 1.190" with STI mags and steel spacers without issue. Just asking as some progressive presses load "longer" when all stations are full verses one at a time.

And I've found that Silhouette does vary some lot to lot. I had one lot that went 173 PF with 8.4 grains and the next lot I got took 8.8 grains. My current lot takes 8.9 to get there.



Yep, I'm sure of the length. I'm using Zero bullets and they seem to have a very broad nose and as they tilt in the mag the nose rubs. I do have some variation in the mag's. At 1.170-1.175 they will feed in 2 of my 4 mags.

I have noticed a difference in COL of 0.005 or so between single loading vs all stations loaded but I calibrated for a fully loaded press.

I've loaded up a small sample at 1.170-1.175 as a control group and two small samples at 1.160-1.165 and 1.150-1.155. Haven't tried them in the mags yet.

After I try them out, I'll decide if I keep the spacers and load shorter or get neew followers and load long. It's interesting to hear you need to go all the way up to 8.9 gr and you're loading quite long. If I lose the spacers I may go that long.

Thanks for the info.

Edited by Rob Tompkins, 23 July 2010 - 08:41 PM.

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#384 Aircooled6racer

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Posted 23 July 2010 - 08:00 PM

Hello: The powders I like best for 9mm open are 3n37(hot and harsh), Silhouette(clean and softer) and finally HS-6( softest and best I think). I have been playing with 121 Montana Golds and there 115JHP in my shorty 9mm. I am liking the 115's with Silhouette so far. I need to do more testing with HS-6. I run the power factor up to 171-173 with an OAL of 1.170". I need to do some more testing with a timer to see if the 121's or the 115's are better for me. A great steel load are the Montana Gold 95gr with HS-6 at 126PF :cheers: Thanks, Eric

#385 Rob Tompkins

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 06:59 PM

I've loaded up a small sample at 1.170-1.175 as a control group and two small samples at 1.160-1.165 and 1.150-1.155. Haven't tried them in the mags yet.

After I try them out, I'll decide if I keep the spacers and load shorter or get new followers and load long. It's interesting to hear you need to go all the way up to 8.9 gr and you're loading quite long. If I lose the spacers I may go that long.



Part II

All loads are 8.0 gr of Silhouette.

1.170 - 1.175" 1338 1371 1352 33 11 169 AIR TEMP ~80DEG 1.170 - 1.175"
1.170 -1.175" 1340 1384 1364 44 15 170 COOLED ~40DEG 1.170 -1.175"
1.160 -1.165" 1351 1398 1375 47 15 172 AIR TEMP ~80DEG 1.160 -1.165"
1.150 - 1.155" 1351 1392 1371 41 13 171 AIR TEMP ~80DEG 1.150 - 1.155"

The ambient air temp was way down to about 80 deg and all loads had been sitting in the air conditioned cab of the truck. This makes the control sample about 15 deg cooler then last time. I was also very careful to make sure no bounds exceeded 1.175".

I also took some of the 1.170" COL rounds and placed them in a cooler with my ice water to create a larger temp differential. They cold soaked for about 45 min (drive time to the range).


Observations: Except for the 1.150-1.155 loads all primers looked OK, a little flat but still a curve on the outer edge and no firing pin craters. Some of the 1.150-1.155 loads were a quite a bit flatter and showed some firing pin drag. The 1.150 - 1.155 loads fit well in the mags but the primers make me nervous. The 1.160 - 1.165 loads also fit in the mags and gave me the a nice PF. The 1.170 - 1.175 loads had a much better performance (about as originally expected) and with very good SD, but it could be the cooler temps. Some of the 1.150 loads seemed to shoot flatter

Conclusion: I'm going to stick to the 1.170 COL (I noticed I could do a better job of fitting the spacers - then space should not be a problem) and also try 8.2gr and 8.4gr to see how it goes. I'd like to get a reliable 171-173 PF.

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#386 Edjosh

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 02:25 PM

Here are the latest loads that I have Chronoed as I develop loads for 9Major.

Barrel: Bar-Sto Precision Length: 4.25

Bullet 124 Jacketed Hollow Point Zero 0.355
Case: Winchester
COAL: 1.145

Powder Hodgdon Longshot

Chg High Low SD CV MAD CV ES Average PF
6.6 1287.2 1261.8 9.60 0.75% 8.00 0.62% 25.4 1273.4 157.90
6.8 1349.5 1302.9 16.90 1.27% 13.60 1.02% 46.6 1323.4 164.10
7.0 1361.7 1321.6 11.90 0.88% 9.00 0.67% 40.1 1338.4 165.96
7.2 1372.9 1326.9 17.90 1.32% 15.00 1.10% 46 1354.7 167.98
7.4 1396.8 1377.4 6.70 0.48% 5.60 0.40% 19.4 1387.9 172.10

Powder IMR 7625

Chg High Low SD CV MAD CV ES Average PF

5.0 1181.6 1136.5 13.50 1.17% 8.50 0.73% 45.1 1148.9 142.46
5.2 1184.3 1154.5 10.70 0.91% 29.80 0.76% 29.8 1170.9 145.19
5.4 1203.9 1180.2 8.90 0.74% 8.00 0.67% 23.7 1193.1 147.94
5.6 1241.6 1221.9 6.50 0.52% 5.40 0.43% 19.7 1230 152.52
5.8 1275.1 1224.9 14.70 1.17% 10.90 0.87% 50.2 1250.2 155.02
6.0 1297.8 1233.6 21.30 1.68% 17.00 1.34% 64.2 1265.6 156.93


Powder Vihtavuori N350

Chg High Low SD CV MAD CV ES Average PF

6.0 1244.7 1201.7 12.80 1.04% 10.50 0.85% 43 1222.1 151.54
6.2 1272.8 1224.5 14.40 1.15% 10.10 0.81% 48.3 1241.6 153.96
6.4 1305.6 1248.2 14.60 1.14% 9.70 0.75% 57.4 1277.3 158.39
6.6 1340.9 1297.0 12.60 0.95% 9.20 0.69% 43.9 1320.7 163.77
6.8 1383.8 1339.3 13.20 0.97% 9.80 0.72% 44.5 1357.2 168.29
7.0 1378.8 1342.4 10.90 0.80% 9.20 0.67% 33.4 1362.5 168.95
7.3 1402.0 1363.3 14.10 1.01% 10.80 0.77% 38.7 1385.7 171.83

UPDATE: Add Ramshot True Blue data
4-18-2004 Added loads from 7.4 - 8.0

6.2 1119.6 1089.3 9.4 0.85% 6.9 0.62% 1100.5 30.3 136.5
6.4 1145.4 1114.2 9.9 0.87% 7.0 0.62% 1137.2 31.2 141.0
6.6 1194.7 1157.0 11.5 0.98% 8.3 0.71% 1171.8 37.7 145.3
6.8 1204.0 1188.1 5.9 0.49% 4.6 0.38% 1197.4 15.9 148.5
7.0 1284.5 1213.9 20.4 1.66% 13.8 1.12% 1234.2 70.6 153.0
7.2 1288.8 1231.7 17.7 1.41% 14.0 1.11% 1259.3 57.1 156.2
7.4 1294.0 1266.0 10.5 0.82% 8.3 0.65% 1278.3 28.0 158.5
7.6 1329.0 1303.0 8.4 0.64% 6.7 0.51% 1314.0 26.0 162.9
7.8 1387.0 1356.0 11.1 0.81% 8.7 0.63% 1369.5 31.0 169.8
8.0 1398.0 1382.0 5.8 0.42% 4.3 0.31% 1390.7 16.0 172.4

UPDATED 7625 INFO Added 6/25/05
Note: The bullet and OAL are only for the following two 7625 loads only.

Bullet Hornady 124gr FMJ encapsulated
Cartridge OAL 1.178

Average Avg PF Hi Low AvDv StDev
7.0gr 1342.56 166.5 1355 1322 8.05 11.02
7.2gr 1372.6 170.2 1392 1358 10.72 12.75



Will Update this as I get more info

Alan Meek :)



#387 Edjosh

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 02:39 PM

Hi Alan,

I need your advice I'm planning to buy the STI Grandmaster and I can't decide which one between 9 mm or 38 super. I have the STI Steel master And I love using it. I though of geting the super 38 for major load coz, I heard that it easy to make a major load for super 38 You're are the expert and more experienced with 9 mm major load is it complicated to make a 9 mm major load? I normally do my own reloading with my 45 ACP and my 9mm. I usually use
WSF for my 9 mm and Win 231 for my 45 ACP. I'll wait for your advice

thanks
Edjosh

#388 CocoBolo

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 03:35 PM

Hi Alan,

I need your advice I'm planning to buy the STI Grandmaster and I can't decide which one between 9 mm or 38 super. I have the STI Steel master And I love using it. I though of geting the super 38 for major load coz, I heard that it easy to make a major load for super 38 You're are the expert and more experienced with 9 mm major load is it complicated to make a 9 mm major load? I normally do my own reloading with my 45 ACP and my 9mm. I usually use
WSF for my 9 mm and Win 231 for my 45 ACP. I'll wait for your advice

thanks
Edjosh

Alan until a couple weeks ago I was definately against the TruBore Barrel Comp. STI was at the TX State Limited and I noticed that they had changed the design of the true bore comp. The walls of the comp are now perpendicular to the bore line which is going to make the comp slow the slide down more which is good. When it comes to 38 Super vs 9 mm and I have both I can tell you in major it is easier to tune a 38 Super Load to a gun, just a lot more choices. When it comes to brass I think its cheaper to run 38 Super (comp). I use 9 major just one time and I pickup or buy once fired brass and put it thru a case pro. I load the super comp till it splits or I lose it.

I'll agree that the Steel Master is a great little gun, and a couple friends have tried major and they got the gun to run but its just too violent with major loads. The Grand Master and I'll say its a good gun and all that but for the money a new one costs there are a lot better options out there, for a few more bucks you could be running a new custom gun from one of the great builders. I'll let the rest of the gang preach that song. My sponsor was shooting a Steel Master and as an STI dealer he could have had what ever but went with the Match Master. If the TruBore or GM had the fat trimmed off the slide like the match master I might just snag one on the used market, provided it had the newer comp design and I'd probably drill a nice little hole in the barrel to tame it down a pinch. On the other side of the coin another friend was shooting a 9 mm GM and bought a Steel Master, that GM is getting very dusty these days, I have not seen him shoot it this year he is always running the steel master. They all run Quinn or Cheely mounts, darn copy cats. When it comes to getting an open gun built you need to do more listening than talking, these guys that build them know what works.

Edited by CocoBolo, 26 July 2010 - 03:39 PM.

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#389 MoNsTeR

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Posted 19 September 2010 - 03:36 PM

I've reached the end of my 8 pounds of 3N37 so I'm finally getting around to trying out some other powders. Here's my first round of results.

Common to all:
Bedell 9mm, 5.4" KKM barrel, no ports
MG 124gr JHPs, 1.175" OAL
Wolf Small Pistol primers
1x R-P brass
PACT MkIV chrono

First I re-measured the 3N37 load I've been using:
7.9gr 3N37 (measured on my old scale, questionable)
Avg 1390.5 (172.4PF)
SD 8.5
ES 26.4
N 8

IMR 7625:
6.9gr / Avg 1362.9 / PF 169.0 / SD 11.6 / ES 34.5 / N 9
7.0gr / Avg 1374.9 / PF 170.5 / SD 17.6 / ES 59.4 / N 8
7.1gr / Avg 1388.7 / PF 172.2 / SD 8.6 / ES 22.8 / N 7
7.2gr / Avg 1402.8 / PF 173.9 / SD 8.0 / ES 21.2 / N 9

Meters very well for a flake powder. Cases not as full as I expected. Primers only started showing faint signs at 7.2.

VV N350:
6.6gr / Avg 1235.3 / PF 153.2 / SD 7.2 / ES 16.2 / N 6
6.8gr / Avg 1253.3 / PF 155.4 / SD 11.0 / ES 37.1 / N 9
7.0gr / Avg 1292.9 / PF 160.3 / SD 7.0 / ES 21.9 / N 7
7.2gr / Avg 1310.6 / PF 162.5 / SD 15.9 / ES 48.1 / N 7

Big disappointment here. Meters worse than other VV powders and the cases are pretty full. Primers not looking so great and I'm not even at major yet. This one goes back on the shelf.

Win. Autocomp:
6.9gr / Avg 1359.1 / PF 168.5 / SD 13.8 / ES 44.4 / N 7
7.0gr / Avg 1377.5 / PF 170.8 / SD 17.8 / ES 52.4 / N 6
7.1gr / Avg 1390.1 / PF 172.4 / SD 9.8 / ES 31.5 / N 10
7.2gr / Avg 1405.6 / PF 174.3 / ES 16.2 / ES 65.3 / N 10

Meters great, and super dense so no chance of spilling. Primer condition good, though not as good as with 7625.

General thoughts:
Aside from the sub-major N350 loads, I basically can't tell the difference between any of these in the limited testing I did. Now that I have loads picked I'll do more serious testing on the plate rack later, after I've worked up Silhouette and HS-6, and tried some 115s.

Edited by MoNsTeR, 19 September 2010 - 06:34 PM.

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#390 Jman

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Posted 19 September 2010 - 04:52 PM

GOOD stuff Thanks!!!

Edited to add:

Let us know the OAL's.

Edited by Jman, 19 September 2010 - 04:55 PM.

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#391 Hannu

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Posted 06 October 2010 - 07:51 PM

Found my new pet powder from IMR 4756. MG 124gr CMJ, Starline brass, WSR primer, OAL 1.175" and 8,1 grains of 4756 gives PF 172. Very nice to shoot, feels almost cheating :) Reloading is, however, painful... I have Dillon 1050 with Rick Koskela´s bulletfeeder but 8,1gr of 4756 fills the case completely so have to run the Dillon pretty slow :( I am not gonna use 4756 for local matches...
Barrel Schuemann 5.4", with poor quality rifling. Only needs 0,1 grains more to meet PF 171 from STI 4.3" Trubor barrel.

I have tested some powders with both STI 4.3" shorty and 5.4" (both without popple holes). One thing is very clear - those guns need different kind of powder to be nice to shoot. Autocomp is super for shorty, very fast cycling and easy dot tracking. 7625 makes dot tracking harder and 4756 is even worse.
4756 is super for long gun and 7625 is ok too. But, Autocomp is horrible for 5.4" gun, feels just like I am gonna break 90 degrees with it :)

What I want to say, is that load that works in your gun very well, might feel horrible in some other gun.

#392 RH45

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Posted 07 October 2010 - 01:21 PM

Found my new pet powder from IMR 4756. MG 124gr CMJ, Starline brass, WSR primer, OAL 1.175" and 8,1 grains of 4756 gives PF 172. Very nice to shoot, feels almost cheating :) Reloading is, however, painful... I have Dillon 1050 with Rick Koskela´s bulletfeeder but 8,1gr of 4756 fills the case completely so have to run the Dillon pretty slow :( I am not gonna use 4756 for local matches...
Barrel Schuemann 5.4", with poor quality rifling. Only needs 0,1 grains more to meet PF 171 from STI 4.3" Trubor barrel.

I have tested some powders with both STI 4.3" shorty and 5.4" (both without popple holes). One thing is very clear - those guns need different kind of powder to be nice to shoot. Autocomp is super for shorty, very fast cycling and easy dot tracking. 7625 makes dot tracking harder and 4756 is even worse.
4756 is super for long gun and 7625 is ok too. But, Autocomp is horrible for 5.4" gun, feels just like I am gonna break 90 degrees with it :)

What I want to say, is that load that works in your gun very well, might feel horrible in some other gun.


I use 4756 as a back-up powder for my .38 Supercomp when I have issues getting vvN-350.

It seems like every batch of 4756 I bought, chronoed different, so, if you're going to use it, get the biggest can you can find!

I never tried 4756 for 9mm major. I really didn't think I'd be able to get enough powder in a 9mm case to make major. I use Zero 125 grain jhps.

#393 Alan Adamson

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Posted 08 October 2010 - 08:33 PM

Tried some Silhouette today... Not bad... I had been using Autocomp in a 9Major load (7.1-7.14g behind a MG 124g JHP @ 1.165 OAL). I've shot probably 3 or 4K of those and it was my go to load, but that may change.

I'm a 5" gun with no poppels, running a 9lb recoil spring and Derek's newest version of his 9mm Comp (3 port, no sides).

I decided to try a 7.76gr Silhoutte load with the same had at the same OAL. PF was right where I wanted it. 171-172, just the same as my AC load., but dot track was much better... I couldn't tell any different in *felt* feel, but dot track was less, still up and down, but about 20% less than the AC load.

I also decided to try one other Silhouette load... 8.3g behind a 115 MG JHP at 1.165. No noticeable feel difference from the above 2, but the dot track smoothed out even a bit more... NOTE, however, this load only made a 168PF, so It's needs to bump up just a smidge, which might effect it a little.

Last notes, my 7.76 with 124 was more tuned to a 9lb spring than the AC load was...It probably needs a 10, double taps at 7yrds - second hit was high and slightly right. Same drill with the 7.76 Sil load was astonishing... while a little right drift, they were exactly same horizontal plane. The right pull could be me and trigger as I was also playing with trigger inserts.

Oh, for the record, Zero was the same with the AC load the the 7.76 sil load... it would need to change just a smidge as it was low about a full dot with the 115 head.

So tomorrow, I'm going to shoot an entire match with the new Sil 7.76 load... should be interesting :)...

All in all a good day...I did note one thing that I'm not thrilled about, the 7.76 load seems to leave this fine yellowish sand mixture on the barrel, and it leave the gun feeling a little gritty. the 8.3 didn't seem to be that way, and I've never had that issue with AC. Might be that Sil is a bit dirtier than AC at the 7.76 range, but with the higher pressure with the 115, I didn't notice this problem. I shot regular SPP on the 7.76 load and no pressure signs.... The 8.3 I went to SRP and they as well showed now signs... I'll try a regular SPP at the 8.3 sometime and provide that feedback back.

Alan

#394 BMartens

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Posted 09 October 2010 - 02:23 PM

Tried some Silhouette today... Not bad...

So tomorrow, I'm going to shoot an entire match with the new Sil 7.76 load... should be interesting :)...


I think you will like Silhouette after you give it a run. Post your match evaluation.

I settled on Sil for 9 major after trying several others. For whatever reason I seem to shoot it better, especially in a match. My back up powder is HS6 and when shooting side by side I can't tell the difference. In a match the Sil performs works way better. I have no idea why because they seem identical.

Current loads:
Mixed Brass
WSR

124 JHP MG - 1.150 OAL - 7.8 gr
124 CMJ MG - 1.150 OAL - 7.9 gr
115 JHP MG - 1.150 OAL - 8.6 gr
115 JHP Zero - 1.145 OAL - 8.7 gr

Storm Lake 5" barrel with no holes.
EGW 7 chamber comp

All chrono between 172 - 176 PF

Also, note the SD's for Sil as you chrono more. They are very low and extrememly consistent.
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#395 Alan Adamson

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Posted 09 October 2010 - 06:02 PM

I haven't run that many rounds through a chrono to note the ES, etc. But it will be hard to be my prior AutoComp load, it was always in the single to small double digits numbers.

However I'll assume it's similar.

Shot the match today, obviously the timing on the gun was a little different and I've got close to 3K rounds of my other load in the last 6-9 months. It took me a stage or 2 to settle down with the gun, but when I did, I actually felt pretty good with it. I went 1 for one, in a rather quick time on a start and this is the first time I decided to try to shoot it in the zig-zag pattern instead of just waiting for the next plate to come to you down one side...

Even activators that were pretty quick with static paper between it the swinger or drop turner or clamshell went off with out a hitch.

I *would* have shot a great classifier, but didn't call a Mike on the *draw to* target, but the time was excellent.

I'm not willing to throw out my original load with the bathwater just yet, but this definitely has potential. If it wasn't for that fine yellow sand like matter that is inside the slide after shooting, it was pretty clean, even the comp was pretty decent for over 150-175 rounds shot - sorry, I've become one of those anal souls that cleans there comp after every time I shoot it... I let it go one time to 1000 rounds... NEVER again.

Anyway, I want to do some more spring, etc testing, but this is a noticeable improvement..... and in the right direction.

#396 Alan Adamson

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Posted 16 October 2010 - 01:17 PM

Ran a bunch more tests today...

SP2
HS6
2 Sil loads with 115 and 124
3n38
True Blue
and my stand by Autocomp load.

Got a new victor after further testing, for both dot track *and* feel... 3 way tie at the moment.
SP2
3n38
True blue

Leaning towards the True Blue load. Both the SP2 and the 3N38 load were so similar that I couldn't tell any difference. The True Blue load however was noticeably better than either the Silhouette load I had been shooting recently (my new favorite at the time) or my standby Autocomp load.

Now to load up a lbs of 3n38 and true blue and do a further test... I do have a bunch of SP2 as well, but it's only for match use if I go to that powder... it really might not be necessary after todays testing however... and NO it's not for sale! :)

Alan

#397 JThompson

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Posted 16 October 2010 - 05:50 PM

There's a lot of great info here, there is also a lot of waste.... IF you are going to post a load it's useless to do so without a OAL. Please remember this when posting a load. Not only is it incomplete, but a newb might not know that X load with Y OAL is fine, but X load with Y-.040 could go kaboom!


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#398 Team Amish 1

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Posted 16 October 2010 - 07:07 PM


5" 2011 9mm at 1.170" w/124 CMJ, comp only, no hybrid holes


9-May 78° F
Powder weight ave FPS ave PF
Longshot 7.6 1,332 165

20-Jun 93° F
Powder weight ave FPS ave PF
HS-6 7.6 1,329 165
HS-6 7.7 1,347 167
HS-6 7.8 1,365 169
HS-6 7.9 1,402 174
HS-6 8.0 1,406 174
HS-6 8.1 1,413 175
n350 7.4 1,384 172

Team Amish can you enlighten us on your impresson of N350? I have a bunch of it but didn't think it would be much good in 9 major.



Cocobolo,

just read your post. Nice chatting with you again in Vegas, by the way.

The chronoing seemed to say it's really consistent, also not temp. sensitive. Plus, it's clean.
I felt it had quite a kick to it but tracked very nice straight up and down. A little more gas at lower velocities would be nice.
In the mean time I've tried a couple other powders - cheaper ones - but may go back to n350.


HS-6 tracks the same for me but without the kick. The 170+PF loads I tried had very little dot movement and felt nice and soft. The 173PF load that chronoed at around 1400fps in 93°F heat was chronoed again in the high 70's/low 80's and came in at 166.7PF and then again today at 165PF. Don't think I like that.

A fellow shooter from Houston recommended trying Silhouette. I'll give that and Win AutoComp a try and post again.
a.k.a. Amos Yoder
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#399 JThompson

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Posted 16 October 2010 - 08:55 PM



5" 2011 9mm at 1.170" w/124 CMJ, comp only, no hybrid holes


9-May 78° F
Powder weight ave FPS ave PF
Longshot 7.6 1,332 165

20-Jun 93° F
Powder weight ave FPS ave PF
HS-6 7.6 1,329 165
HS-6 7.7 1,347 167
HS-6 7.8 1,365 169
HS-6 7.9 1,402 174
HS-6 8.0 1,406 174
HS-6 8.1 1,413 175
n350 7.4 1,384 172

Team Amish can you enlighten us on your impresson of N350? I have a bunch of it but didn't think it would be much good in 9 major.



Cocobolo,

just read your post. Nice chatting with you again in Vegas, by the way.

The chronoing seemed to say it's really consistent, also not temp. sensitive. Plus, it's clean.
I felt it had quite a kick to it but tracked very nice straight up and down. A little more gas at lower velocities would be nice.
In the mean time I've tried a couple other powders - cheaper ones - but may go back to n350.


HS-6 tracks the same for me but without the kick. The 170+PF loads I tried had very little dot movement and felt nice and soft. The 173PF load that chronoed at around 1400fps in 93°F heat was chronoed again in the high 70's/low 80's and came in at 166.7PF and then again today at 165PF. Don't think I like that.

A fellow shooter from Houston recommended trying Silhouette. I'll give that and Win AutoComp a try and post again.


I shoot Sil too...
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#400 edwin garcia

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Posted 16 October 2010 - 09:03 PM

There's a lot of great info here, there is also a lot of waste.... IF you are going to post a load it's useless to do so without a OAL. Please remember this when posting a load. Not only is it incomplete, but a newb might not know that X load with Y OAL is fine, but X load with Y-.040 could go kaboom!


JT


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