Ive read that to make weight with a Shadow, you have to use a 10rd mag. Do you have to use all 10rd mags, or can I get by with using 1-10rd mag and 2-19rd mags loaded down to 10rds ?
CZ SP-01 Shadow question
Started by
DWFAN
, Feb 18 2010 09:12 AM
13 replies to this topic
#1
DWFAN
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 09:12 AM
IDPA - A39275
USPSA A-67338
Great things happen when you are not thinking about fast or slow and are just paying attention.
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USPSA A-67338
Great things happen when you are not thinking about fast or slow and are just paying attention.
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#2
clown
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 09:23 AM
Yeah, you have to use the 10-rounders throughout. page 19 of the rulebook.
#3
Strick
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 10:04 AM
Yeah, you have to use the 10-rounders throughout. page 19 of the rulebook.
The rule you are referring to just means that you can't use different round counts in different magazines. You can use higher capacity magazines but you can only load as many as your lowest capacity magazine.
To answer the originalo question.......If you need to use 10 round mags to make weight then you need to use them the entire match. Switching after you have made weight means that you are now overweight.
#4
clown
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 10:17 AM
I'm aware you can use high caps loaded to division max.
SSP page 19-20
"Competitors must use the same capacity magazines throughout the competition. (Example: if you start with a 9 round magazine, you must use that capacity magazine throughout the match.)"
SSP page 19-20
"Competitors must use the same capacity magazines throughout the competition. (Example: if you start with a 9 round magazine, you must use that capacity magazine throughout the match.)"
Edited by clown, 18 February 2010 - 10:20 AM.
#5
Duane Thomas
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 07:24 PM
Short answer: no.
Pride and fear are emotions, which hope for an outcome. Outcomes take your attention from the present, where the shooting happens, to the future. It is totally impossible to do anything in the future, because it hasn't happened yet. The key to shooting your best is to be present as the witness of the shooting. Do not judge, do not give yourself anything to live up to. We can only shoot as well as we have trained ourselves to shoot. To try to shoot only induces stress. Be content with your current ability. And accumulate practice to improve that ability. Consolidate, build strength where you feel weakness. We cannot raise our ability until we accept our current limitations. Practice dissolves limitations. Matches simply define where the current limits exist. The game of shooting is all about redefining our limits.
- Sam
Amateurs do it til they get it right. Professionals do it til they can't get it wrong.
"It's not the will to win that matters - everyone has that. It's the will to prepare to win that matters."
- Paul "Bear" Bryant
"The only reason why Everest is the highest mountain ever climbed is because it's the highest. If there was one higher, I bet there'd be people trying to climb it."
- Jack Barnes
- Sam
Amateurs do it til they get it right. Professionals do it til they can't get it wrong.
"It's not the will to win that matters - everyone has that. It's the will to prepare to win that matters."
- Paul "Bear" Bryant
"The only reason why Everest is the highest mountain ever climbed is because it's the highest. If there was one higher, I bet there'd be people trying to climb it."
- Jack Barnes
#6
RobMoore
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 07:56 PM
If you're using the 10 round mag to make weight, you can't simply supply it at weigh-in and then switch to larger ones that don't make weight. That would be cheating.
If all your mags make weight, you can mix capacities, just not the amount of ammo you put in them, which is a non issue in high-cap SSP guns. They all get loaded to 10.
This rule is really about 1911 .45s switching between 7 and 8 rounders (or 9mm 1911s between 9 and 10 rounders) to tailor capacity to specific stages so they run dry at a better time.
If all your mags make weight, you can mix capacities, just not the amount of ammo you put in them, which is a non issue in high-cap SSP guns. They all get loaded to 10.
This rule is really about 1911 .45s switching between 7 and 8 rounders (or 9mm 1911s between 9 and 10 rounders) to tailor capacity to specific stages so they run dry at a better time.
#7
eerw
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 08:22 PM
you gun would need to make weight with all your mags..
so if it makes weight with the 10rnd mag, it will also need to make weight with the 19rnd mag.
so if it makes weight with the 10rnd mag, it will also need to make weight with the 19rnd mag.
There is no charge for awesomeness -- Po, Kung Fu Panda
#8
MIT_Shooter
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 08:31 PM
I think that DWFAN was asking why you need to use 10 rounders to make weight with a Shadow. I've been told that they 10 rounders are lighter than the stock steel mags because the lower 1/3 is plastic. I am interested in more advice on this subject though. I have a Shadow and want to shoot it in IDPA but haven't weighed it. I have only heard that it's too heavy and needs to slim down. Anyone know how to lighten the gun but stay compliant with the rules. I need to review the rule book, but I know that you can't shave any weight from the slide. What are people doing to shoot Shadows in IDPA? I've heard of lighter grips. Is it legal to shave a couple of ounces from the dust cover area of the frame? Is that a bad idea? I love the heft of the gun but a couple of OZ doesn't seem like it would change that materially.
#9
Duane Thomas
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 08:32 PM
Check out the CZ forum under Factory Guns. There's extension discussion of this topic there.
Pride and fear are emotions, which hope for an outcome. Outcomes take your attention from the present, where the shooting happens, to the future. It is totally impossible to do anything in the future, because it hasn't happened yet. The key to shooting your best is to be present as the witness of the shooting. Do not judge, do not give yourself anything to live up to. We can only shoot as well as we have trained ourselves to shoot. To try to shoot only induces stress. Be content with your current ability. And accumulate practice to improve that ability. Consolidate, build strength where you feel weakness. We cannot raise our ability until we accept our current limitations. Practice dissolves limitations. Matches simply define where the current limits exist. The game of shooting is all about redefining our limits.
- Sam
Amateurs do it til they get it right. Professionals do it til they can't get it wrong.
"It's not the will to win that matters - everyone has that. It's the will to prepare to win that matters."
- Paul "Bear" Bryant
"The only reason why Everest is the highest mountain ever climbed is because it's the highest. If there was one higher, I bet there'd be people trying to climb it."
- Jack Barnes
- Sam
Amateurs do it til they get it right. Professionals do it til they can't get it wrong.
"It's not the will to win that matters - everyone has that. It's the will to prepare to win that matters."
- Paul "Bear" Bryant
"The only reason why Everest is the highest mountain ever climbed is because it's the highest. If there was one higher, I bet there'd be people trying to climb it."
- Jack Barnes
#10
DWFAN
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 09:12 PM
I understood the rule as it would apply to loading below 10 rounds to gain an advantage of a earlier slide lock reload. I have 1 10rd mag and didnt want to buy more, but it looks like I'll need to if I want to shoot IDPA with it. No big deal, I figured I knew the answer before I asked, but wanted to double check. Thanks guys.
IDPA - A39275
USPSA A-67338
Great things happen when you are not thinking about fast or slow and are just paying attention.
be
USPSA A-67338
Great things happen when you are not thinking about fast or slow and are just paying attention.
be
#11
Steve Koski
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 10:39 PM
Do 10 round mags really weigh less than full cap mags? If so, any idea why?
#12
Albert
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 11:30 PM
Do 10 round mags really weigh less than full cap mags? If so, any idea why?
There is more metal in the 18/19 round magazines as opposed to the 10 round magazines which are metal 2/3 and plastic with a hollowed out section of it's base. The 10 round magazine also has a shorter therefore lighter spring.
I would agree that if you weigh in with a 10 round magazine, to be a good sporstman, you should have enough (3) that make weight with the gun to compete in the match.
Making weight with an SP-01 is possible with lighter grips, replacing the factory recoil spring and using the 10 round magazines. Some may need to swap out the heavier thumb safeties with the smaller/lighter safeties from the standard SP-01. I haven't made that last mod to my Shadow and opt to shoot an older standard SP-01 that makes weight with some of my 18/19 round magazines and is under 38 oz. with my 10 round magazines.
#13
Steve Koski
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Posted 18 February 2010 - 11:38 PM
Makes sense. I didn't know about the partially plastic 10 rd mags. Thanks.
#14
MIT_Shooter
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Posted 19 February 2010 - 05:25 PM
I did check the CZ posting and that lead me to this:
http://www.marschalg...=CZ_SP01-models
It seems the way to make weight is to use light grips and 10 round mags with the plastic base. Unfortunately, the only way to know before I throw a hundred bucks at it is to do some calculations on the current weight, the current weight of the grips and the mags and to see if I can find any specs for the 10 round mags to compare to. I don't think this is going to happen this weekend, but if I get it done, I'll repost. If anyone has done this, let us know what it gets the weight down to.
http://www.marschalg...=CZ_SP01-models
It seems the way to make weight is to use light grips and 10 round mags with the plastic base. Unfortunately, the only way to know before I throw a hundred bucks at it is to do some calculations on the current weight, the current weight of the grips and the mags and to see if I can find any specs for the 10 round mags to compare to. I don't think this is going to happen this weekend, but if I get it done, I'll repost. If anyone has done this, let us know what it gets the weight down to.
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